I have just arrived back from a short break where I got to be "Leeanna" . I was staying on my own for a few days. I dressed for extended periods and even went out for a walk.
Like many of the ladies on here to a varying degree, I realised I wanted to be a girl when I was young. Around five years old in my case.
When I was growing up, all my positive role models were women. Men on the other hand were mostly angry and drunk. I had a great aunt that would threaten me with "be good, or a man will come and get you." It may also have been my mother and her sister had 7 boys between them, and no girls. Any girl they saw was doted on. I always envied them for being pretty, and being able to wear pretty clothes.
While I was relaxing reading stories on here a few nights back, I wondered.
If women dressed, looked the same (as much as possible, short hair , no makeup)acted and were treated the same as men, would I still want to be one? So imagine a world where we all wore grey jump suits , and underneath a plain grey vest and shorts.
I understand with some people there are varying degrees of dislike for their male genitalia. Is this due to what they represent? Or is it deeper that?
Please understand i really don't mean to offend with this question, just trying to understand more.
Thanks
Comments
Despite what some would tell you
I'm not very feminine in my presentation. pants, comfy tops, no makeup, fairly short hair. I also cant have SRS.
but every "ma'am" or "lady" makes me feel happy.
so that's all I really need.
Hi Dorothy , I get that. I
Hi Dorothy , I get that. I think the reason I go out and walk passed people without a glance gives me the same positive feeling.
Leeanna
Gender has little to do with genitalia…….
Yes, I was born with the wrong genitalia, and spent my entire life wishing I had been born correctly, but I was never one of those who hated my penis so much I wanted to cut it off.
It was a birth defect that needed to be corrected - like having an extra leg, or six fingers on my hands. I didn’t want it, and wanted it to be corrected - but not enough to cut it off myself. It was something to be endured and cope with until I could have it corrected medically. To this day, I regret the fact that I could not be the person I was inside, and even after transitioning I still am not that person. No matter how close I get, I still never see that woman when I look in the mirror. But that is my burden to bear, and I will always remember that my life could be so much worse than it is. I know - I have seen just how bad life can be, and just how little life means in so many parts of this world.
As for clothing, well, I have always enjoyed dressing nicely even as a man. Of course, now I have many more and much better choices, lol. But being female is something inside, and the clothing and other accoutrements are simply things I do to make myself feel better and look better.
The true test is that when I am lying in the dark unable to see anything or feel anything, I still know that I am a woman. Always have been, and always, always, always will be.
D. Eden
Dum Vivimus, Vivamus
You and many others say "I
You and many others say "I still never see that woman when I look in the mirror." It doesn't help when TERF's say you never can or will be a woman, but who needs their approval. If you are happy with what you are, that's what matters.
Leeanna
Environmental Motivation?
The great-aunt who threatened, "be good, or a man will come and get you", was not a good role model. When your mother and aunt dotted on any girl they saw, that wasn't exactly good either.
If the men were mostly angry and drunk, why? Or could that have been an exaggerated observation or memory? Or perhaps there was "the joy of discipline" and the notion that torture's good for a child?
-- Daphne Xu (a page of contents)
Drunk was only some of the
Drunk was only some of the time. Intimidating would be a better description. Before I was 10 my father beat my mother up, knocked her front teeth out and gave her 2 black eyes. Later I found out this was because she found he was having an affair , and threatened to leave him.
I think I may have not wanted to be a man anyway , and this sort of thing confirmed it. I never told anyone though.
Leeanna
Father
About your father, yikes!
Did you ever figure out that your great-aunt's threat, "Be good or a man will come get you," meant that your great-aunt was in league with men?
-- Daphne Xu (a page of contents)
Aunt dotted on girls
Well, I don't think I would appreciate being dotted on though. Well, maybe she used a soft brush and as long as it is not permanent ink it might be okay. Was she into pointilism?
^_^
Anyway, like Dot, how I am dressed is a relatively minor plus. Sure I don't want to be a slob but I rarely ever do the girly girl thing in real life anymore. For me, how I look without any clothes on is more important. Most important, and Dot hit it right on the spot, is what one totally identifies as.
A Mix Of Abnormal Psychology and Genetics
I spent lots of time trying to make sense of things and now maybe there is just no sense to be made of life. From my time as a toddler, I presented as a girl, and my mom treated me like one. Then my evil stepfather came and he told me to act like a man or he'd kill me. Later they'd so some genetics and I am XXY, so sort of both. I've been living as a woman since 2005 and had surgery in 2007. This is the best time of my life. I left just lots of the story out.
Almost Everyday I've Thought of Suicide
It is one of the main reasons most large companies do NOT want to hire transsexuals. When they check out who are they taking with them? What damage will they do to the company? There is also exactly the opposite where companies seek transsexuals because of their unique drive to be over achievers. Not just the male or the female but both sides of the mind of transsexuals seem to be engaged. Most transsexuals are MENSA range but dumb down during tests to try and fit in normally. I use to have a list of said companies but over the years and lost HD. Never trust computers to save research data.
I pray I'm not saying something to embarrass anyone on this channel. No one would believe the number of PhD writers and readers on BCTS if they haven't been reading the comments over the years.
At age five or six I begged God to take me back as I knew suicide was not a way out. One is tossing God's gift back in Her face and saying it wasn't good enough. So shall we begin and explain exactly what MtF transgender is since that is the one my research led me toward.
There are varying degrees of transgender, those wishing or desiring they were the different sex from that which they had stamped on the birth certificate. Some mange to handle the MtF drive by cross dressing. Others are driven to self mutilation or hopefully SRS (sex reassignment surgery). There are those like myself who are resigned to the body they were born with and could be called Tomboy as we have the brain structure of a female but surgery is too expensive to correct the (birth defect) so we live with it as many who were born with birth defects. Hormones help to a limited degree to stabilize the drive as testosterone blockers castrate the male anatomy and female estrogen hormones feminize to a limited degree. Sadly there are those who have reached a decision they will never find the body and mind matching up so the final act is suicide.
Transgender brains are more like their desired gender from an early age
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/05/180524112351.htm
Transsexual differences caught on brain scan
https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20032-transsexual-dif...
Do yourself a favor and stop by Lynn Conway’s pages. The net wouldn’t be existing today as it is if not for this amazing lady.
https://ai.eecs.umich.edu/people/conway/TSsuccesses/TSsucces...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynn_Conway
Hugs Leanna, accept yourself hon and live your life as best you can. Find a counselor if you need support. There are TG groups out there which didn't exist twenty years ago. Careful as not all of them are a fit to what you seek. DM me if you wish.
Barbie Jean Lee, your Oklahoma Connection
Life is a gift. Treasure it
Oklahoma born and raised cowgirl
Thanks Barb, that's a great
Thanks Barb, that's a great description of the whole trans "thing". Sometimes I feel that as a lowly crossdressers, that I shouldn't comment on trans issues. I would like to be full time, but I wouldn't want to put my loved ones through the trauma. I don't hate being a guy most of the time, but enjoy my time being Leeanna so much more. Perhaps I savor it for being so brief.
The problem with being a crossdresser, is it covers a wide range. From someone that enjoys wearing one item for a quick thrill (I have no problem with it, whatever floats your boat), to someone that goes all the way and presents a female in public.
As far as IQ goes I had a message conversation with Renee M, about the same. I left school at 17 to become an electrician, so never did A levels or a degree. I tested around 120 on a few tests for jobs. I put this down to my early dressing making me consider every scenario, not to get caught.
I'm glad you decided not to commit suicide , x Therapy for me is talking to the nice people on here.
Leeanna
Companies Actively Seeking Transgender
https://tinyurl.com/y27f9c43
This is one of many lists now. Nine companies who seek transgender employees. I don't fully agree with all those on this list but it's a start.
https://ripplematch.com/journal/article/companies-that-advoc...
Oklahoma born and raised cowgirl
Don't Know What Would Have Happened.
Judging from what people said to me, many thought I was gay. My own wife wanted me to be more masculine. She thought that in spite of my living a very dangerous employment life. Her own father was a hypermasculine Logger,a and full blooded Native American. He was so far above me, that I never tried to measure up. One time he and his sons got me to shoot a very big hunting Rifle (.338 Win ?) and they seemed disappointed that I just did it with no problem. I thought their Whiskey was awful though.
I had enough internal masculinity to get through life without bragging or feeling the need to prove myself. For me, men that sit around talking about their big trucks or big fish are beneath my notice.
I was too busy working, raising children, and being at her beck and call to think of Suicide until the kids were gone and she was doing overseas relief trips. 20 years later, she spends lots of time at AAA, is remarried, and I am a post op woman. Probably won't suicide. As to my family, Fuck them.
Wow Gwen. It's sad that men
Wow Gwen. It's sad that men are expected by some women to be hyper masculine , and by others to be sensitive caring and kind. It's not that they have to be exclusive , but they generally are. Women that man up and do traditional "guy" things are applauded, guys that "woman up?" and do traditional female things, are laughed at and derided.
I'm glad you got where you needed to be Gwen.
Leeanna
It's not about the clothes
It's about feeling okay with yourself, or as close as you can get. The clothes can help in projecting what you want the world to see and can help in disguising anomalous bits of your physique. I enjoy the occasional opportunity to look tidier than I usually do and may wear a skirt or dress and even some makeup, but most of the time I'm dressed in jeans and a sweatshirt while I work on my university assignments or do my conservation activities.
After 35 years of living as female, 31 post op, I don't feel I have anything to prove, at least in that sense and have come to the conclusion that those who don't want to look at me can look past me, I have more important things to think about. I'm living the dream, so to speak, and I admit to being much more girly in the beginning, now I'm closer to 70 than 17 so I dress for comfort unless trying to make an impression.
Angharad
Thanks Angharad, I think if I
Thanks Angharad, I think if I was going for it , I would be super girly at first, then ease off knowing that I can always dive back in.
The look I go for now is "average" so I don't stand out.
Leeanna
Average me, not wanting to stand out
Just before I went for a walk
Leeanna
In my case, it's mostly about gendered expectations
One problem with this question is that a world which didn't divide humanity up into two groups ("male" and "female") and then try to force people in each group to be as different as possible from those in the other group would be so different from the one we live in, I don't think we can really conceive of it.
For me, being trans is mainly my reaction to being forced into a gender role that was so contrary to my nature that I simply rejected it. Growing up, people kept insisting I was "male" and that I had to be all this awful stuff that I hated. So, for me, "male" wasn't who or what I really was on the inside, it was society's way of making my life hell. And transitioning was about finding a way of throwing off those awful expectations for once and for all. I never "identified" as a man, and I can't say that I now "identify" as a woman. I say that I "live as a woman," and refuse to get into the dumb old arguments about whether I am "really" a woman.
I think my desire to change my body is about not wanting people to gender me "male" when they see me. I don't want them to treat me as "masculine" or insist I act "masculine" when they see my body. I've thought a lot about SRS in the almost 5 years since I started pursuing it, and I've come to the conclusion that what I want from SRS is to look like I'm part of the team "woman." As long as what I end up looking like is within the range of what cis women look like, I'm okay with it. I don't have to be pretty (though it would be nice!) or sexy or anything. I don't even have to "pass" 100%. I just want to be able to undress in a women's changing or locker room and not feel out of place. I want to be able to look at myself in the mirror and without too much suspension of disbelief see a woman there, rather than a man.
It's all hypothetical, but I kind of suspect that if I lived in a world where I would be accepted and seen as normal when acting and reacting the way that is most natural for me, even when categorized "male" and having what we now call a "male" body, I might not feel the need to transition or to change my body. But note the word "might."
(Cf.: the categories "delicate" and "rugged" in Heather Rose Brown's story For Want of a Comma)
Hi Asche, I do guy things,
Hi Asche, I do guy things, although thankfully the lines are growing blurred on that now. It is a gender role we are forced into just after we are born. I think I may be the same, and perhaps many of us. Perhaps my need to appear female is really all about saying "i'm not a man"
Leeanna
Thanks , yes I think the
Thanks , yes I think the question is too complex and we are all doing what we do for different reasons
Leeanna
To each her own
I don't ever recall actually hating my genitalia, it was just something awkward and ugly that I wanted rid of.
Behavior-wise, I'm very much a lipstick.* Got plenty of jeans, but I hate flannel. With jeans, it's a blouse, t-shirt or a sweatshirt. But if I'm not getting dirty I prefer a nice top or blouse, maybe a cute dress. I crave heels, the higher the better. Three - four inches, even on my work shoes, is normal for me.
* Lipstick - Lipstick Lesbian or Very Femme Lesbian. Also Gold Star Lesbian, never had sex with a man.
"Life is not measured by the breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.”
George Carlin
And the answer is
"If women dressed, looked the same [...] acted and were treated the same as men, would I still want to be one?"
The answer for me is: "It's complex." And of course it: "It depends." But ultimately the answer is: "It's up to me."
We live in a wonderful and terrible world full of expectations and presumptions. Of causes and effects. Of things that seem as if they were caused by flapping butterfly wings half a world away and things that an atom bomb cannot not change.
In the end. After all the research and analysis and therapy and meditation it does seem to come down to, for me at least, how I perceive myself. And how others perceive me.
Personally I love beautiful clothes. And I love people wearing them well. A big part of how I perceive myself is through fashion and the artifice of costume. I especially live that thing we call "feminine". It seems hard for me to untangle the feminine from the female and from all the rest. There is little point, from my perception in doing any of this without that reward of looking fantastic. Of course, at this point I'm more the matriarch than I am the ingenue. Still, I love the feel and presence of truly feminine presentation. Annie Lennox in a suit and tie for example. Patrick Swayze in To Wong Fu for another.
I can never be female, in the genetic sense. I can probably be a lady, in the cultural sense. And maybe even feminine. In the eyes of others.
I'll always be a feminist, in the rights of humans sense.
I hope I'm never asked to speak for anyone else. But to answer your question, for myself. I'll have to say. I'd be disappointed if somehow all the decorative, impractical, fantastical fashion and costume were to disappear. While a the same time I understand why not everyone wants to dress that way all the time. At the same time, I'm not sure that I want to be a woman.
Peace
Crescenda
AKA
Your friend
Crash
Thanks Crescenda,I am
Thanks Crescenda,I am starting to use "lady" when referring to trans ladies. I know all the arguments are around the word "woman" currently. No one has really mentioned lady. So it seems safe.
What I could have asked is if males wore what females do, would you still want to be/appear as female. I think it is the whole package . We see how women are treated, dress and behave and say "I want that."
Leeanna