Today, I was told that a transexual person had taken Estrogen for so long that her body had started making its own. Hmmmmmm
Well, I knew that there is some Testosterone in the body of a female, and it could seem reasonable that the body of a normal castrated XY male could have a little Estrogen in it even with out using pills, patches or shots. It seems rediculous that a T girls body could produce enough estrogen on its own.
So, knowing full well that there are those here who have substantial medical expertise, I thought I'd ask if it can happen that way. Now, I will have to say that it is to my advantage for certain people to believe it can happen that way, so I am going to stifle the urge to fall to the floor and laugh until I expire or something like that.
What say you?
Khadija
Comments
Estrogen
Believe it or not, my body transitioned to female without me taking any hormones. I went to several doctors over the years and all said that I had a high estrogen level for some reason that none could ascertain. I have now had surgery so do not have to worry about any testosterone messing things up. So, as you can see, it can happen.
Hilltopper
That is the cse in othe species
Other species do not appear to have as much issue with hormone deficiency. For example cats, dogs, cattle etc are routinely desexed but the desexed male does not suffer from hormone deficiency. It appears that these hormones are also produced by other glands. I am sure there is an endocrinologist (or someone close to one) lurking somewhere to enlighten us.
Adrenal glands
In both sexes, most of the sex-related steroid hormones, of all kinds, are produced in the gonads, i.e. the testes in males and the ovaries in females (and yes, this is a gross oversimplification, leaving out all forms of intersex but it does cover at least about 97% or so of humans). In other words, testes produce lots of testosterone as well as some estradiol, and ovaries produce lots of estradiol as well as some testosterone (not to mention the progesterone produced by ovarian follicles).
But even with those organs removed or otherwise not functioning, the adrenal glands (sitting on top of the kidneys) produce small amounts of both hormones as well. A year or two before the gonads start pumping out hormones and causing puberty, the adrenal glands start making smaller amounts, helping the gonads mature.
In my own case, before starting any HRT of any kind, my estradiol level varied between 35-40 pg/ml, which is kind of toward the high end of "normal" for a male but about what you'd expect for a menstruating female, and higher than what you'd see in a typical post-menopausal woman. This was high enough for me to have some gynecomastia (breast tissue development) a few years ago--I think somehow my testosterone shut itself down for a few months, or my body was somehow temporarily insensitive to it, letting the estrogen do its work--and also to get a fair amount of breast development last year on just androgen blockers. In fact even since starting full HRT, my estradiol levels have only climbed to between 75-125 pg/ml, or only 2-3 times what they were naturally. To have it at those levels without taking supplemental hormones, especially after the testes were removed, would be pretty unusual, but I can't imagine it would be unheard-of.
No need to fall to the floor laughing
All males and females have estrogen and testosterone, We all start out as girls in the womb. I'm intersexed so my estrogen level is above my testosterone level and my body maintians a nice level of estrogenwithout taking any hormones. When I have been prescribed hormones it was as a supplemental ( very minimum dose).
I'm not on hormones now, and have a very feminine body. As I lose my wight my high cheek bones my waist and body begin to become feminine. since I had breast augmentation I have no problems presenting female.
In fact when I joined curves, my masurents were all female.
So Gwen, no need to take a dive to the floor in a fuir of laughter.
One more thing my testosterone level is below that of a genetic female. Why do you think some women end up in electorlysis having a moustache removed.
Jill Micayla
May you have a wonderful today and a better tomorrow
Jill Micayla
Be kinder than necessary,Because everyone you meet
Is fighting some kind of battle.
Estrogen matters
As some above have indicated, most humans have a mixture of Estrogen and Testosterone in their bodies, it's just the proportions of both that make us what we seem to be.
Couple of points: In women, testosterone is produced as in men, but it is actually an intermediate product in the creation of estrogen. That's right, women produce it, normally it's all mopped up and turned into female hormones. In men, there's probably a lack of some kind of enzyme or whatever which means that it doesn't get mopped up: ergo manly physique.
(Too lazy/tired to use interwebs to look up links.)
I also understood that estrogen gets made in breast tissue, which means that there's a positive feedback loop going once you get breasts. This might be where Gwen's story comes from. It's a pity that the estrogen also seems to be responsible for most breast cancer :(
Penny
Oestrogen Matters...
Hello to everyone,
The wikipedia within BC is alive and well.
I wish to refine a point made by Penny in her last sentence. Penny writes "that oestrogen also seems to be responsible for most breast cancer". This is not quite accurate. Oestrogen can contribute to the growth of certain types of tumors. Some tumors grow bigger and faster in the presence of high levels of oestrogen. Like fire that burns hotter and brighter in the presence of high concentrations of oxygen; neither of which is a problem in the normal scheme of things.
Remembering what cancer is, and that is, normal tissue growing out of control, many breast tumors feed on the oestrogen circulating in the body. Endocrine surgeons can differentiate which tumors these are, and would recommend that while removing the primary tumor is a good thing, reducing the endogenous oestrogen in the body by removing the ovaries would also reduce the chance of more oestrogen eating tumors developing.
Depending on the size and location of the primary tumor, a recommendation might be to have a Laparoscopic Oophrectomy (key-hole ovary removal) first, to starve the tumor and shrink it. Combine this with chemo-therapy and/or radiation and the tumor will reduce in size. This may mean a less aggressive form of mastectomy may be possible.
Robyn B
Sydney
Robyn B
Sydney
Oestrogen
is produced in fatty tissue, so fat men often have more oestrogen than androgens. It is also produced in the adrenals along with androgens. It's not just the amounts produced or taken but about 'receptors', so those with large numbers of oestrogen receptors will be more receptive to the hormone, those without won't be receptive at all.
Remember too that steroidal sex hormones are potentially dangerous, especially if taken without medical supervision and high doses can kill (except in sloppily written fiction, where characters grow large breasts overnight).
Angharad
Angharad