Years ago I wrote It Brings On Many Changes. http://bigclosetr.us/topshelf/fiction/481/it-brings-many-cha...
The lyrics to the song that inspired the title were written by a fourteen-year old Mike Altman. It was meant to be "the stupidest song ever". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_Is_Painless
That suicide is painless
It brings so many changes
And I can take or leave them if I please
We all know suicide is never "painless". Most suicides are unsuccessful and involve a tremendous amount of self-inflicted pain. Those suicides that are successful leave huge painful holes in the lives of those left behind.
When I first posted that story I was surprised how many of my online friends elected not to read it, because they didn't read anything that involved suicide. Over time I've come to believe that stories that involve suicide are not the best thing.
I wonder if as a community we should resist including suicide attempts in our stories, or even thoughts of suicide. Aren't we risking dire consequences based on the copycat effect?
What are your thoughts?
Jill
Comments
I think
I think if their is a positive outcome for the person involved. ie, they are at their lowest, but then their life changes for the better.
If it was the outcome of a story, then no. In our little world suicide is a lot closer than for most people. I for one do not want to read about it in a story. But that's just me.
I have tried to commit suicide,
it is not something I am proud of, but have to acknowledge. I have friends who I worry about doing the deed.
By itself, it is not plot worthy. It is a sad reality of our population however. You can not write very many TG stories and not run into it. My story has mentioned it, though none of the characters actually committed suicide.
So I would say we have to acknowledge it. It is a reality we have to face. Just keep in mind it may be a trigger for a sensitive soul on the edge.
Hurts
The person that commit suicide is out of there HURT but so many family and friends are left behind that start to HURT
Reality
I can understand the reluctance of some to reading that kind of story, however. . . .
Look at some of the accepted genres here: forced feminization, identity death, identity theft, sissy, humiliation, bimboization, mind control, and bondage, just to name a few. And there are a couple of caution flags for suicide alone.
Don't forget stories that involve infants, toddlers and children. That can be pretty reprehensible too.
And If I Recall Correctly there was a story written that was so upbeat that when one reader compared it to his own miserable life it drove him to consider suicide.
Suicide is a part of the lives we have chosen, and it is a legitimate topic to include in a story. In fact I just read a chapter of a post-WW2 story that discussed the aftermath of a suicide and the effect it had on the survivors. A very legitimate topic that fit well with the overall nature of the story.
So while I may not read all the stories that use suicide as a plot or a plot device, it is a legit subject to use. Either that, or we can stick our fingers in our ears, close our eyes, and yell "Nah, nah, nah! I can't hear you, I can't see you!"
They know they can survive
Yes
It was one of my stories that drew the threat of suicide because it showed such a loving family.
I tend to agree any topic is fair game. I also know the numbers on copy cat actions.
Jill
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)
So...
I'm a person who tried to suicide once. For months now I've been in a dark blue funk. I think about it fairly often. Am I going to try again? I don't know. I'm not quite to that point again yet. Would a story about suicide push me over the edge? I don't believe so.
~And so it goes...
Mash
Part of the Lyrics to the theme song for "Mash" included the words "suicide is painless". I did not know this until very recently.
I've got a half dozen hospitalizations and two serious attempts. Perhaps I was just too incompetent to actually pull it off?
I am post op, but the rejection by family just made life too miserable. Something happened and after 12 years, I just gave up on them. At some point perhaps we have to just accept our situation?
I recently discovered three Bible scriptures that made my life much better. Fearing offense to some, I won' share them here. Those interested can PM me if you like.
Ahabidah
MASH theme song...
If you check, the title of the theme song for mash is the song Suicide is Painless the op linked to the wikipedia entry for.
Stupidity is a capital offense. A summary not indictable.
For the television series...
it was an instrumental. The only time the lyrics were sung was in the movie M*A*S*H, during "The Black Capsule" segment. If you've seen the movie, you would know that the doctors rigged things so that the capsule wasn't lethal.
Actually...
They did use the song with lyrics in a couple of early episodes in the first season. Not as the theme, but a character playing a guitar singing it.
~And so it goes...
my post is still accurate
in that I only state that a bit of research will show that the theme song for the series is suicide is painless. :p
I was not making any comment about inclusion of the lyrics in the opening or show. [ though for season 1 at least the theme song title is in the end of show credits ]
Stupidity is a capital offense. A summary not indictable.
my thoughts
I think it is more harmful to turn a blind eye to suicide than to write about it. When 46 % of transgender people attempt suicide, that makes it a significant part of our community that demands to be addressed even in fiction. I have several stories that have suicide or suicide attempts in them and they have all went over fairly well (with the exception of the suicide scene in A different Kind of Life, but the complaint was that the suicide sequence turned out to be a dream and boy were people pissed).
The key is how do you address it. Do you give people enough warning? Which can be a double edged sword. If you warn people it's coming it takes off the edge and sometimes that edge is needed. On the early rounds of Wrestling Against Myself, the suicide attempt is mentioned in the prologue and that diminished it's effect later on. In Pink Pajamas I sprung it on people and that was received well.
I believe if it is handled with class and a modicum of sympathy, it will go over fine and be a needed addition to our library. You're a good author, I have no doubt that you can make it work. I advise against trying to force it though, just let it come.
Katie Leone (Katie-Leone.com)
Writing is what you do when you put pen to paper, being an author is what you do when you bring words to life
Good Advice
I don't think my muse wants that kind of story coming from me, but others should heed your words.
Jill.
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)
avoid censorship
Unfortunately, suicide is real and a part of much transgender experience. It should be an open option for authors, provided they give readers warning. It's sad that even helpful Bible verses are self censored to avoid offending some.
different than I thought
I read the post title and was thinking more real world and talking about it than in the stories.
in either case, yes it does have a place here, as others have mentioned in their answers, suicide is a major part of t-folk communities. WE need to talk about it and include it in stories.
When there is a major depression happening in our lives, having somewhere we can go and talk about what is bringing us down is a huge help in getting through it without trying to commit suicide.
In stories the support network that can help in the situation can be showcased, again giving members a nudge into talking about the issue(s) and hopefully avoiding yet another senseless death.
Stupidity is a capital offense. A summary not indictable.
Real world
"Real world" is another tag supposing there may be suicide theme. Over 90% of tg people in my country and in nearest neighborhood have attempted suicide. So if it's not a "magic transformation" suicide theme would be more common than "sweet sentimental".
Poor people
I wonder where you are, but I do know the rate in the Republic of Ireland is horrendous. The USA has a higher rate than here, but ours is decreasing steadily. Me? Two attempts.
I write 'real world' stuff. The comment has already been made about forced fem, identity murder and so on, so I will continue to avoid that where I can and stick to as real a picture as I can. Suicide is real, and distressingly common. Many of my characters have contemplated it, and indeed started preparations for it by cutting people out of their lives, taking extreme risks and so on. Sophie actually steps over the edge in her own despair. That is the dark side of reality.
What I cling to, though, is the brighter side of humanity, to family, friends, love. If you want to know how I feel, read my short stories "Sunlight and Shade" and "Dark Night of the Soul". Both of them have references to suicide, but it is not the point of the tale.
I've written about suicide attempts
Including one where a character had to apologize for the harm their attempt caused.
I've been on that edge myself, somehow walking away without actually injuring myself each time. A good story can use anything - dark or light to make it work.
Although I'll be honest and say I kinda prefer where there is some light at the end of the tunnel ...
As much as I go for happy stories only...
at least when it comes to what I want to read, I do believe that having stories that deal with situations like suicide, mental illness, and other "controversial" subjects is a positive for the site, because ignoring the presence or persistence of a negative in one's culture is never a good thing, and though stories about suicide can be depressing, they can also help people to both deal with their own pain and get a firmer grasp of what their actions would do to those they love.
There are too many trans suicides because the people who kill themselves are terrified of what it would do to their family should they come out, yet they don't consider the alternate and potentially more harmful pain their suicide causes to those same people. Likewise, dealing with suicide isn't always something that has to be overt or graphic: I tried my best to handle it in a subtle yet understandable way in my story "Faith," for instance, and I've tackled it much more bluntly in my drabble "Now I Disappear." Of the two, I think "Faith" handles the situation better, and helps to demonstrate the consequences of it more: that one's decisions do affect others, and that those close to you, when given the choice, would most often rather have you alive and happy than dead.
Negative emotions, bad occurrences, death and pain and heartbreak always have their place, and they SHOULD have their place. In many situations in real life they take far too much of a focus, that could be turned toward more uplifting or positive media and experiences, but here at BC I think we've got a good mix: plenty of positive, plenty of emotional and realistic, with just enough of the dark and/or depraved to make sure that people remember it's there.
And that's the way it should be.
Melanie E.
Stories containing Suicide (or attempted suicide)
I originally wrote 2 stores in 2002, and posted them to StorySite.Org ( http://www2.storysite.org/a_juliechristine01.html ) under the pseudonym JulieChristine and later reposted them to TGFiction.Net ( http://tgfiction.net/viewuser.php?uid=4 ) and did an StoryLink link here pointing to them at TGFiction.Net. If I remember correctly, people wishing they had been warned about the content in those 2 stories is why we added the entire "Caution" tags list here @ BigCloset. Many people were upset that there was no forbearance to that type of content. But then again, those that read the two stories here said they were very powerful and well written so there is a market for the content, no matter how small. Just make sure to make use of the Caution tags.
-Piper
I will utilize it in my
I will utilize it in my writing, but only if I feel it's appropriate. It's not glamorous it's not 'beautiful' it's just dark, it's cold and it's sad and it should be portrayed as such. I won't shy away from uncomfortable subject matter, but I won't glorify the ugly.