Bad Writing

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I used to be a regular subscriber to a British magazine called SFX. Rather annoyingly, the front page was always designed so that the 'F' was slightly obscured, giving everyone the impression that you were buying a magazine called SEX, but that's by the by.

The best feature was always right at the end, where considerable space was given to reviewing recent SF and Fantasy fiction. The reviews were often uncompromising. I remember one comment to the effect that any writer who uses the phrase 'in actual fact' should be hung, drawn and quartered.

That was over the top. But on the whole these reviews proved to be a reliable guide to the pitfalls a budding writer can blunder into. Which brings me - at last! - to the point of this blog.

What mistakes do authors* commonly make that you think should be avoided? What kinds of things make you stop reading and look for something better?

*Feel free to criticise anything you've read on this or other similar sites. But please don't refer to non-professional authors or their works either by name or implication. If they've made money out of their fiction, they're there to be shot at. If not, consider them untouchable.

Comments

Okay.

Here's my biggest pet peeve. Talking down to the reader. It's okay if they don't understand everything your showing in a story, especially when it's a heavily science oriented one. Just give them a picture good enough that they can at least see what is happening without lecturining them about it with unneeded details. I once read something named The Persimion Sequence or something like that which was hailed as being a truly scientific SF novel. Yes, I understood most of what was said or shown in the book, but it sucked big time. I never finished reading it because it was talking down to me as I read it. Plus the dialogue was lousy. lol.

Maggie

It pains me to say it, but

It pains me to say it, but science and literature seem to be mutually exclusive. The most readable account of the development of quantum physics has to be John Gribbin's In Search Of Schrodinger's Cat. At the end Gribbin recommends Gregory Benford's Timescape as the best SF novel ever written.

It isn't. The writing is clumsy, the characters are flat and the narrative is deeply confusing.

Ban nothing. Question everything.

What about...

erica jane's picture

Hyperspace by Michiu Kaku?

Wonderful book, in my opinion. Fun, yet not condecending. Digs deep into string theory and multi-dimensional space-time.

~And so it goes...

A friend and I have a debate

A friend and I have a debate going about Michiu Kaku. He thinks that Michiu Kaku is Grant Imahara all grown up and traveled back in time. I on the other hand think that Grant Imahara is an android that was made by Michiu Kaku.

Almost...

thliwent's picture

Grant likes to build the robots. Kaku is an android built by Grant.

I beg to differ

If you consider the works of two well known SF authors, Arthur C Clarke and Isaac Asimov.

Clarke was involved with Radar development in WW2 and personally, a lot of his stories are really well crafted.
Asimov is the same and he published a lot of non fiction as well. His laws of Robotics are brilliant and the 'universe' he created using them was a reading staple for me when I was a lot younger. I found his, Clarke's and Henlein's stories very readable after reading the C.S. Lewis Space Trilogy. I found his writing very tedious.

Other really good story tellers are people like Harry Harrison (stainless Steel Rat), Verne, Wells and Fred Pohl.
Ok, I am not ashamed to admit that I am a fan of what is more often called 'classic SF'. I don't get along with Fantasy or what is branded mainstream SF these days. Frank Herbert just sends me to sleep.

not having direction

I think the main mistake I see in a bulk of Trans fiction, and its not just on this site, is the author not having a clear direction of where the story is going. I'm not talking about people who post long serials like Bike, which is really a bunch of little plots together like seasons on a sitcom, but people who's story starts jumping all over the place without any rhyme or reason and without any foreshadowing. I was guilty of this early on in my writing with my initial works. I would get an idea or a set up and would start writing, taking a "let's see where this leads us," mentality. My work jumped all over the place, bizarre things happened for no real reason, problems solved themselves without the character working through them (which takes the fun out of reading about a character), character's don't remain consistent, and you wind up with 100s of thousands of words without really getting anywhere.

Now, I understand people are not going to outline like I do (I usually have a long, drawn out, tedious outline with lots of points, some have seen them), but I do think a loose outline would help people who want to write a story (as opposed to scenes or episodes). I notice that there are some stories that don't end, they just constantly go on and on, but even an episode needs to have a conclusion before going onto the next episode. Part of me thinks the reason these stories don't end is because the author doesn't know what the ending is.

When I wrote How Life Can Change, I was pretty much guilty of these things and I am speaking of my own experience. The thing that helped me the most was not posting stories until they were complete. It gave me motivation for getting to an end.

I hope no one takes offense to this. In the end, you write on this site because you enjoy writing and want to share. So, if you're having fun, take what I said with a grain of salt.

Katie Leone (Katie-Leone.com)

Writing is what you do when you put pen to paper, being an author is what you do when you bring words to life

It's called...

erica jane's picture

Walking to the story. Or that's what one of my writing teachers used to call it.

It's a combination of not knowing the exact point that your story should start at, and not being self-disciplined enough to cut extraneous material before posting/publishing.

Having an outline does help with this, but being able to edit your own work and "kill your darlings" is an even better way to keep this type of thing from happening.

However, I don't think this is really a sign of bad writing, per se. I feel it's more bad editing than anything else. For the best example off the top of my head, look at Harry Potter. The first book, was fantastic. But, by the time that Rowling got to The Deathly Hallows, the money paid for that book also precluded it getting the same level of editing that The Philosopher's Stone received (Publishers by and large don't let editors take a real cut at books they pay multiple millions for unless they are unreadable without major editing).

~And so it goes...

For me, it's all about

For me, it's all about character development. One of the best novels I ever read - I've searched cyberspace, hyperspace and every other kind of space you can think of looking for it - was about a teenage girl from a well-to-do family who was forced to live in a dystopian city and turned from a wallflower into a rebel simply because of the language she picked up. Sorry I can't be more specific - the novel was written in the late 80s/early 90s and may have been by Jack Vance or someone with a similar name.

This interweb malarkey...it's no good when your memory fails you utterly.

Ban nothing. Question everything.

The hardest part is the ending

You get a gem of an idea and off you go hitting the keys or scribbling like mad and a story develops.
Then.... bang. How do you end it all nicely and with no loose ends?
A lot of writers just stop with no ending and the readers crying out for a conclusion.

I will put my own hand up here. I'm as bad a anyone in this respect. I've been writing TG Fiction for a little over 10 years and in all that time, I have only had an ending certain in my mind before starting to write once.
A few more devlop as I'm going on but very few of my works end with everything nicely wrapped up in a package. That's life I suppose.
But upon reflection I do tend to leave more than a few loose ends in my stories. Mostly it does not matter at all but sometimes it does.

Then you have the rarer situation. The one where you know what you want the ending to be but getting there? Not easy at all. I have one story (not published on BC but started on Crystal's) that is up to part 16 and I'm really struggling to put the last bits to bed in a way that seems feasable. I think I'm on my 8th or 9th different draft.
Bah Humbug, now where that brick wall I've been trying to demolish with my forehead?

The ending it is indeed

Patricia Marie Allen's picture

I've started reading many a good, well written story and simply gotten tired of the story long before it ever got down to an ending. Worse yet is the scenario you've described where the story simply stops without an ending.

I have nearly a twenty megs of disc space tied up in stories that I started to write and just couldn't reach the end and hence gave up writing them. Each one, I felt was a gem, but ended up shattered as I took a whack at cutting the facets. I keep hoping that one day I'll get back to one of them and do what ever rewrite it takes to get the story back on the way to an ending... Alas, I fear that I'm not able to "kill my babies" and will never be able to do it.

Hugs
Patricia

Happiness is being all dressed up and HAVING some place to go.
Semper in femineo gerunt
Ich bin eine Mann

Good writing

persephone's picture

Nicki,

We are all human and thus have our weaknesses. When I read your blog I thought that rather than focusing on the bad it would be easier to focus on the good as to why we keep reading despite those weaknesses.

As a straw man for debate might I suggest three reasons why a story keeps our attention?

  • Novelty
  • Empathy
  • Readability

Novelty can be considered an exciting, intriguing or different twist. A new way of seeing things, or a radical new environment. A lot of great SF and fantasy is driven by this, whether it be Terry Pratchett or Frank Herbert.
Empathy is the ability to link with and 'feel' the characters. The story might be millennia old but the presentation of a loveable character will always win readers. Jane Austen or Georgette Heyer are perhaps archetypes here.
Readability is about presentation. Not only the quality of one's spelling and grammar but also the ability to paint a scene with words.

Frequently we see criticism of spelling and grammar here. I might draw the attention of those who do so to the raw manuscripts of Jane Austen (whose drafts made editors weep) which you may find here.

Therefore what keeps me reading is two out of three of the above. We all can (and should) forgive much, but to be entertained we all want to be rewarded as readers for our forgiveness. :)

Persephone

(P.S. A bestseller should do all three.)

Persephone

Non sum qualis eram

What always grates for me ..

... is when the writer gives us a brief biography and description of his/her characters. They 'tell' us rather than 'showing' us things that should come out naturally as the story progresses. As an example, there's no need to tell us what the character's name is when another character can reveal it easily by using it in conversation.

I know 'Moby Dick' starts with "Call me Ishmael" (IIRC) and some 19th century fiction tended to include these character description but that doesn't make it any better in the 21st century. Jane Austen manages perfectly well without it :)

There's at least one very popular and prolific writer of TG fiction that's regularly guilty of this 'sin'. No names but can you guess? :)

Robi

I recognise the benefits of

I recognise the benefits of 'show, don't tell'. Then again a couple of weeks ago I listened to 'The Legend Of Sleepy Hollow' on Radio 4 Extra. It was all 'tell' and as close to perfection as I ever expect to hear. I think 'show, don't tell' is a failsafe for writers who can't tell properly.

But that's just my opinion.

Ban nothing. Question everything.

Mistakes

Melanie Brown's picture

While someone has already touched on this, one of the things that drive me crazy on stories posted here is that there will be a paragraph or two of story and then it all comes to a grinding halt by the first person narrator saying something like "Perhaps I should introduce myself. I'm Blah Blah blah...etc."

There was one story I read quite a few years back on Sapphire's that was over-all well written and the author was doing an excellent job of creating the imagery and feel of being in a forest on a moonlit night. Then all of a sudden, the story halts while the author had the character tell about some ghostly legend her mother told her as a child instead of integrating the legend into the narrative. It was jarring and it took a while to get back immersed into the story. It also irked me that the protagonist had to return to being a boy to be victorious, but that's a different issue.

Know the difference between there, they're, and their. And, then and than. And woman and women.

While it doesn't bother some here, I get annoyed at pages of unattributed dialog. The technique loses it's effectiveness after 3 or 4 lines, which is really the most you should use it. They may be out there, but I've yet to pick up a professionally written story with pages of just dialog, no descriptions, no attributes to who is speaking or their emotion at the time.

Dialog is problem in and of itself. I see a lot of dialog on this site that seems unnatural or stiff. Say your dialog out loud to see if it still sounds the same as when you typed it.

I usually don't post things like this because it just seems to make people angry at me, so I'll stop now. :)

Melanie

Yours is exactly the kind of

Yours is exactly the kind of response I hoped for, Melanie. Dialogue is such an effective tool, and so often it's misused.

Rule #1. Every new speaker needs a new line. To quote Bill Hicks, this is not a matter of taste, this is not a matter of opinion. It really isn't.

Rule #2. Make it clear who is speaking. This doesn't mean you have to add 'said Susan' or 'said Tom' every time, in fact if you do it comes across as amateurish. What you have to do is give the reader other, more subtle clues.

For example...

Carol's eyes flashed.

"You're lying."

I looked from her to Julie.

"Sorry, this is none of my business."

That wasn't what I'd expected. Julie knew how I felt. I'd counted on her support. There was only one thing I could do now.

"I'll be honest with you. I reckon you deserve that."

Ban nothing. Question everything.

That's exactly ...

... what I meant in my earlier contribution. It really is irritating and makes me become detached from the story. It's often the point at which I stop bothering to read further.

Robi

Write peeves

The biggest peeve I have is numb nuts that write religion into a story. Sorry but that is just wrong on so many levels.

Second I have is prewords to a story. In this chapter we see so and so become x I don't need that.

In TG fiction I have problems with people turning perfectly NORMAL males into females. There is a few authors that have done just that. It's bad. Your born this way or not, you can't make someone that way. it's actually an insult on those that really are tg.

Re: Write peeves

thliwent's picture

I think that's more a per-reader thing. I love both normal and fully transgender individuals becoming female because the main draw for me is the discovery.

The discovery of self, learning who this new person is and who they can be. I cherish the moments they learn and grow.

Stories like Bike are amazing tales of a transgender person becoming who they always wanted to be, and learning what that means.

But that can be counterpointed with Gaby, who doesn't *want* to be female. Andrew Bond never wanted to be a girl, and was quite happy with his genitals as he knew them. That doesn't make the story any less enticing.

I can say I'm not always a fan of forced feminization but I'm not against stories that involve a non transgender person learning to love the female they've become through whatever circumstances.

The fact that there is a genre full of this self-discovery, that also matches my own needs and hopes for transition, means I find myself empathizing and desiring many of the circumstances in these stories.

Gaby

Maddy does an excellent job keeping your attention in Gaby. Yes Gaby wants to be male but unknown by Gaby she is intersexual, and chromosome wise a bio female. So Gaby is a kind of a forced feminization story, except it is her body forcing her to be female, instead of some outside person.

One of my biggest pet peeves, in any place, but especially for stuff I pay for (Books, Magazines, Amazon, Lulu, etc.) is lack of proof reading. I don't mean use a spell checker, but I have seen published material where they even forgot that. I mean reread, and have other people reread, it and make sure the correct names are used, correct words: suck, duck; gun, fun; etc. are easy typos to make.

I am not so upset here when unproofed material is posted, but if you are selling it, I expect it proofed. If it is not proofed don't expect me to buy another story from you.

I'm just saying...

thliwent's picture

Biology is the antagonist there, for a long time (and in my first comment I was trying to avoid spoilers if people aren't caught up) Andrew had every reason to believe 'he' was male, there was never a desire to be female. I personally think Gaby is going to be wonderful girl, as she's already shown.

Gaby is among my favorite stories.

I have actually borrowed

I have actually borrowed books from my local library, returned them and said, "You do realise this hasn't been edited properly, don't you?" (This was a vampire story, one of a series of three, set in south-western France).

All I received by way of reply was a shrug of the shoulders.

Just as bad were the historical novels my mother used to read. Norah somebody or other. Christ, that stuff was barely literate.

Ban nothing. Question everything.

Peeves

Melanie Brown's picture

If handled right, there's not really a problem with writing religion into a story. The character's beliefs can be part of their internal conflict that either causes doubt or affirmation in dealing with being transgendered, for example. I personally avoid overt religious content, but it doesn't bother me when I read it.

I don't like to see any content outside the context of the story, but I see no problem in introducing a chapter of a serial in the teaser. I don't usually do it myself.

Um...wow...you've just eliminated about 99% of all TG fiction. I don't like stories where some poor random schlub is targeted to be changed into someone's mindless overfeminized sex slave. But if they do it to themselves either by accident or stupidity or allow it to happen, then that's different. Sometimes it's fun or at least just interesting to watch someone squirm as they deal with their new situation. Sometimes the forced fem stories, which play heavily into fetishisms, provide some relief to the reader to see someone feminized and it's not their fault so they can temporarily absolve themselves of any guilt they may have about being transgendered. It's the fight for identity and the journey of self-discovery, that inner conflict, that makes for a story.

If the protagonist isn't changed in some significant way between the beginning and end, then you really don't have much of a story.

Melanie

Religion's okay. A good

Religion's okay. A good source of conflict. It's only on the (thankfully) rare occasions that an author decides to preach that it becomes a problem.

Prewords? I totally agree. But in skilled hands and with the right kind of story they can work. See John Barth's 'The Sot Weed Factor'.

As for 'normal' males into females, I may be wrong but I assumed that most trans women who use and contribute to this site were brought up to think of themselves as male until they discovered that they weren't. Suddenly or gradually they had to come to terms with the fact that their psychological sex wasn't the same as their physiological sex. They didn't choose this, I mean who would? So the forced femme or whatever it's called sub-genre would seem to be an appropriate cypher for the experiences they've been through.

(I may be talking garbage here, I won't be the least bit offended if anyone disagrees.)

Ban nothing. Question everything.

My biggest peeve....

Andrea Lena's picture

...I do write about characters with views on faith, and while they might not be completely numb....I still have nuts.... ah well....

  

To be alive is to be vulnerable. Madeleine L'Engle
Love, Andrea Lena

Literary criticism

All good points, and I agree with most. Here are my "Okay, I'm giving up on this one" pet peeves.

1. Extremely poor spelling (along with 'using the wrong word') errers. If your going to right, at least dew it accurrately.

2. Pick a point of view and maintain it. Being put into the mind and thoughts of more than one character in the first page..? I'm off to finish that Conan Doyle story.
Only exception to a single POV? A character's thoughts and voice can sometimes work in concert with an omniscient narrator (for those bits happening in the past, far away, or around an important antagonist. There are a very few writers who can carry of multiple-POV stories, but they have very few readers ;-)

3. Telling a reader what the characters are thinking? Bad writer. BAD!
Tell me about their perspective, and even background events and experiences that would affect their thoughts. You can even use first person POV thoughts and voice as part of the narrative: I could do this... I knew I could... (One character only, remember.)
But DON'T tell me, "Vern thought, 'I can do this.'"

4. Don't write in the present tense. It can be done, but it's incredibly hard to do well. Narrate your story in a simple past tense.
Write: 'I walked into the room.' Don't write: 'I walk into the room.' The latter sounds like someone in a trance, narrating a hallucination.

5. Make the characters PEOPLE. People are different. Even twins are different! Describe them, voice them, motivate them as people.
I sometimes watch the pilot of a TV show and have to turn it off in the first fifteen minutes because I can't tell the main characters apart. Oh, I can SEE who they are, and tell you their different names, but they're all the same person: all the men are forthright, well-spoken, same ethnicity, equally wealthy/poor/dressed/styled... And all the women - the same. The writers and director and producers have no story - they have a plot. I'm not going to wait and see if I care who wins/survives/marries when I can't tell the villainess from the heroine.

6. It's been said in another comment here, but when a character says something, and it's after another character's said anything, or after a bit of narration: it's a new paragraph.

7. Characters are people. They talk. Don't tell us what they said: let them speak. "Quote marks and everything." Oh, and say it out loud. Would anyone really say that that way? "Would not they say it different?"
No. "Wouldn't they say it differently?"

I know it's too much, but those are my things, the things which, if present - or absent - will have me looking elsewhere. Even if you wrote a great story, I have to get past the writing.

Thanks,
Michelle

Excellent points, especially

Excellent points, especially #5.

But I feel that writing in the first person present tense has so much potential I'm loath to discourage writers from having a go at it. The only thing I'd suggest is that if you go with it, stick to it!

Actually this reply was so good it deserves some music.
Remember Bourgeois Tagg?

http://youtu.be/TSUriZtGdK4

Ban nothing. Question everything.

1st Person present tense

I agree present tense prose has potential and power, but it's SSOOOOOOO difficult to do well. And it restricts a combined main character first-person/narrator POV (in which so much fiction is written) to very complex grammar forms.

(We used to parody it in school: "Children, parse the verb 'to be.'" "I be, you be, he be, she be, they be. I did be, you did be...")

Michelle

Point #2

thliwent's picture

Robert Jordan? How does he rate? Bad writer or few readers?

According to the WoT wiki the Wheel of Time has 129 unique PoVs and 1,121 shifts in PoV, over 4.4 million words. He also spends a lot of time dealing with character thoughts.

Some of your points are very good, but a good storyteller can bend or break some rules and make it worthwhile. I'd say that prior to getting published professionally, it's a good time to find your style.

For my own writing, I try to do the best I can to emulate writers I enjoy myself. Big names like Robert Heinlein, or Arthur C Clarke, or even Robert Jordan. Or even other writers on this site. I'm a big fan of writing like Bailey Summers, or enemyoffun, or Lillith Langtree. I expect my first few stories will have varying types styles until I've figured out exactly what my own style is.

I also know that I make mistakes in my own writing, some of which could be dealt with by a proofreader.

Alas, my proofreader is me. And me does a shitty job some days. I really should fire me.

All very good points

Thanks, and I acknowledge you make excellent points. Robert Jordan, the fantasy author, indeed used many points of view. And I have to say, I couldn't stand his style. Sorry :-(

My peeves are mine, and they define my reading. Other readers have other POVs, (and yes, I'm secretly winking)

And YEA, the Nth Commandment: THOU SHALT PROOFREAD!

Thanks
Michelle

That's why they're peeves.

thliwent's picture

Everyone has their own tastes. I just have this horrible problem. When I see something that looks like a general statement I feel this urge to poke it with a stick :)

I enjoy playing devil's advocate. I think I do it enough to qualify as a succubus.

For me, I can forgive a lot, but there are stories I've seen where the writing is so bland as to make a lecture on the mating habits of slugs sound like a party. I've also seen stories where things are moving back and forth so fast it's like someone gave meth to the Flash. (protip, don't give speed to the speedforce types)

Both of those tend to get on my nerves. That and giant walls of text where people forgot how to paragraph.

Yes, I did intentionally use paragraph that way :P

I realize it was not a challenge

but you made a story pop up into my miund. You are truly evil (well, maybe the Diet Coke of evil) :P I will give a few hints - a cornucopia of Banana slugs and a slime bed; just see where it goes from there :) I could go on, but I wish to return the torment you have waylaid me with. lol
Hugs
Diana

ps It is even TG related

I loved the early WoT books

but they started to drag. Brandon Sanderson did a great job in finishing that series, and in the Jordon voice. But it was in Jordon's voice. Sanderson's The Way of Kings is an immensely better work IMO, using that author's own voice. It was also a large work, I think longer than any of the WoT series, but it never seemed to drag for me. And, yes, he changed POV throughout. So, for me, it wasn't simply point of view changes that made Jordan's work less appealing.

SuZie

Robert Jordan? Great story.

Robert Jordan? Great story. Ruined it.

Too many characters. The Black Ajah thread never got going. And that map was pathetic (Geography graduate speaking).Since when have continents been perfectly square?

Robert Heinlein couldn't write to save his life. How shit like '666' ever got published I'll never know.

Orson Scott Card. There's another boat that left me on the island.

Proofreading? Read it backwards. Then you won't know what to expect, and you'll pick up typos more easily.

Ban nothing. Question everything.

Heinlein

Melanie Brown's picture

I liked the early Heinlein, but right in the middle of "Stranger in a Strange Land", his brain died. Everything after the middle of that book was just Heinlein talking to himself.

Melanie

Agreed

Starship troopers is a great read.
The first half on SiaSL is probably closest to my perfect book. I'd have been pleased if he'd ended it there but he didn't... sigh

Stranger in a Strange Land

erin's picture

The first half of the book was written in the early fifties but he realized that there would be no market for such a novel at the time. He put it aside for ten years and finished it in the early sixties but it was still too early to market it and it really didn't become popular for about five years after publication.

Many of his best books, like Glory Road and The Moon is a Harsh Mistress were written after Stranger.... The book he was writing when a near stroke interrupted him was Number of the Beast.

Having a second half that is entirely different in tone from the first half is a common feature of many of Heinlein's books.

Hugs,
Erin

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

On 2 and 3...

Personally, I have found writing to flexible for the very reasons you don't like.

Specifically 2 and 3.

2. Pick a point of view and maintain it. Being put into the mind and thoughts of more than one character in the first page..? I'm off to finish that Conan Doyle story.
Only exception to a single POV? A character's thoughts and voice can sometimes work in concert with an omniscient narrator (for those bits happening in the past, far away, or around an important antagonist. There are a very few writers who can carry of multiple-POV stories, but they have very few readers ;-)

You cannot tell a complete story from a single point of view. That does not work. Even the most simple stories require two points of view. The hero's point of view. And the villain's point of view.

Multple-POV stories are easy. The pitfall to make sure that the writing can shift fluidly between the different scenes of multiple points of view.

3. Telling a reader what the characters are thinking? Bad writer. BAD!
Tell me about their perspective, and even background events and experiences that would affect their thoughts. You can even use first person POV thoughts and voice as part of the narrative: I could do this... I knew I could... (One character only, remember.)
But DON'T tell me, "Vern thought, 'I can do this.'"

Getting into the heads of the characters is one of the best strengths writing has over television.

Spy thrillers require thought dialogue. Where the the spy is thinking one thing, and saying something else.

Also, thought statements avoid "word salad" problems in conversation scenes.

Also, writing offers no time constraints. Where in TV, the time is constantly moving a normal pace, and their are time constraints on how much time can be devoted to description.

Where in writing, several pages could be used to describe a single moment.

A truly creative writer could write multiple descriptions of a single scene, from multiple points of view, with thought dialogue from each characters point of view.

Ever heard the concept that no two people see the same event the same way. That is very true.

Have you read 'Vellum' and

Have you read 'Vellum' and 'Ink' by Hal Duncan? You'll hear the sound of breaking glass as all the rules are thrown out of the window.

Ban nothing. Question everything.

About rules of writing

Remember, rules of grammar are about making the writing readable.

I have read a number of different types of ways stories are written. Some from standard third person point of view. Some first person point of view. Some are basically summaries. And I have read good stories done in all those formats.

I have written some myself. And there are limitations of the English language that I hate, when I hit the wall. Such as, there are not be any singular gender neutral pronouns in the English language. I know, I have looked. And "it" does not count, because that word is both to broad, and to insulting. And that is a very annoying limitation when writing transgender fiction.

I am surprised the limits of the English language are not discussed often.

Welcome to the future of literature

Call m Ishmael.Som yrs ago--nvr mnd how long precisely--havng
littl or no muny n my purse,and nothng particular 2 nterst m on
shor,I thot I would sail about a littl and c th w8ry part of
th world.It is a way I hav of drivng off th splen and regulatng
th circulation.Wnevr I fnd myslf growng grim about th mouth;
wenever it is a damp,drzly Nov n my soul;wneer I fnd
myslf nvol1tarily pausng be4 coffn wrhouses,and brngng up
th rear of evry funeral I meet;and esply wnevr my hypos get
such an upr hand of me,th@ it reqyrs a strong moral prncipl 2
prevnt m from deliber8ly steppng n2 th street,and methodically
knoikng peopls hats off--thn,I acct it hi tym 2 get 2 c
as sun as I can.This is my substitut 4 pis2l and ball.W/a
filosofical flourish Ca2 throws himslf upon his sword;I quietly
tak 2 th ship.Ther is nothng surprisng n this.If thy bt knu
it,almost all mn n their degree,som tym or other,cherish very
nearly th sam feelngs 2wards th oshn w/me.

also

2. Pick a point of view and maintain it [unless you have a good reason to change it. Then make it clear that it's changed, who it's changed to, and why]. While I agree that having the POV change too frequently is jarring, it can help to tell the story. There was one story that had a lot of POV changes that did it well, every main character, as it was introduced, used there own POV. I would not suggest that you try similar as it was difficult to do well, and the author mainly used it as a device to introduce them, in the main body of the story he did it less frequently.

3. There are many reasons to show thoughts, because your lying, you need to be quiet (hiding, or in an audience), you had an idea but felt it wasn't worth commenting on, you're trying to be polite. I just read a graphic novel where half of the main characters dialog was thought blurbs, mainly because she was extremely snarky, and was trying not to antagonize everyone around her.

Turn-offs

1, 3, 6 and 7 are all big things for me.

2 I deliberately broke in 'Hard Memory', jumping from one PoV to another without warning. It was done to unsettle the reader, but at the same time I did my best to change the 'voice' of the writing to match the character's.

I have done 4 on a few occasions, but only a few, and only when it is absolutely necessary.

5 is the core of what I try to do with my characters. They are all PEOPLE to me, and they think differently. More importantly, I try to make my characters act, well, in character. If one does something apparently abnormal for them, there is a reason I have not yet shown.

Other little issues are:

Dialogue and grammar. People do not speak in cinematic sound bites, nor do they use perfect grammar. They grunt, they fill, they use slang or dialect or Forn Speak. Write what they say, but tell that story grammatically. Give characters individuality in how they speak.

Omniscience. Certain third person stories work with omniscience, most don't. I write mainly in the first person, others in the third, but in both cases what is revealed to the reader should be no more than the character concerned can know. Make it clear you are changing PoV if showing, for example, the thoughts of both hunter and hunted.

Religion. I am an atheist, but I have written religion into my stories. It is out there, and it affects some of us very directly. I have written Christian sermons, but they are consistent with the character, not necessarily with the author. Give us a character with religious views, for good or bad, and explore the issues/tensions that way. Do not deliver a story of any length in which the Born-Again Evangelical Islamobuddhist-pagan author talks to the reader as if everyone in the world follows their particular sect. They don't; many are actually Buddhislamists, or other splittists.

Personal taste. I don't connect with crossdressing stories as such, because the issue is not one I am involved with. I am not very deeply interested in clothes as clothes. Any story that goes into 'It was a royal blue shantung on a bias cut with a teal band...' leaves me cold. Not all women are into make-up, jewellery and high heels. I also get turned off by stories in which the pretty little 'boy' only has to put on a skirt to become Miss Universe, and as for forced femme... I wrote Sweat and Tears as a slap against that, which brings me to my last peeve.

Bedrooms, and Gwen's comment about one-handed reading material. Sex is real, and important, but I, personally, write love stories. What happened in Sweat was necessary to the plot, brutal as it was, as was the graphic (for me) sex in Playtime, but real love-making is best left unsaid. I mention erections and hardening of nipples, and I make a joke of what Sarah shouts for her husband to do, but in the end any sex I show is connected to two main things: love between two people and the sense of being a fraud as a woman.

what i dont like

Sadarsa's picture

I cant stand reading a story that has perfect grammar....

I know that might raise a few eyebrows, but in the end to me i feel that on a day to day basis NO ONE speaks that way. Sure spelling and sentence structure is very important but an overly perfect story just sucks the life from any character. These stories make me feel more like im reading an encyclopedia than a work of fiction. Don't try to use high vocabulary words, your not impressing me one bit, simply speak like you normally do and all will be well.

~Your only Limitation is your Imagination~

Very insightful. It matters

Very insightful. It matters as much how a narrator speaks to the audience as the characters speak to each other. But vocabulary is important, and you should never be afraid to use words that might challenge your readers. As long as you use them correctly, that is.

Ban nothing. Question everything.

sure!

Sadarsa's picture

Challenging the reader is one thing... but getting too wordy will make for a dry read, and eventually you lose the attention of your audience. I mean, i've seriously read stories about as entertaining as stereo instructions. Tossing in a little used word here and there is no biggie as long as it fits and ADDS to the story.

~Your only Limitation is your Imagination~

Where were you all my life?... :)

That is such a good point. People have accents. But, using them in writing is hard on spelling and punctuation. Though, I think using accents on writing is a good idea.

Perfect Grammar

littlerocksilver's picture

Of course perfect grammar is unrealistic for the spoken language; however, the author's narration should be as close as possible to proper grammar. Intentional errors can be set off by semi-quotes. Misuse of homonyms is careless writing. Misspelling is understandable; however most writing programs have a spell check, and as I mentioned the other day, if you question a word on BCTS, you may in some systems highlight it, right click, and if the word is misspelled be given alternatives. A tough one for me is the ommission of a letter that still creates a good word. Unless a grammar check can catch it, good proof reading is the only answer. I am embarrassed by my poor writing because most often it is the only picture readers have of me. If you want to attract readers, write well (not good). There are a few exceptions. One writer here writes with such powerful emotion that it is easy to overlook a story rife with typos and other mistakes. Still, it wouldn't hurt her stories at all to have them proofed.

Portia

Single biggest annoyance

erin's picture

Single biggest annoyance of a lot of online writing: no blank lines between paragraphs.

Second biggest: no new paragraph when a new speaker begins.

Third biggest: no new paragraph when a new topic begins.

Really, all the biggest problems of reading online are mechanical. After that is proofreading.

Hugs,
Erin

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

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