This is going to be my novel.
The current working title is Love Requiem. Another possible title is Death of a Love Song. I've got the first chapter finished now and am working on proofing it right now.
A little information before I post it and before anyone starts reading it:
1. This will possibly be a tragedy. I have not made up my mind yet.
2. This contains a few autobiographical elements.
3. This is not the same world of any of my short stories in Of Grief and Joy.
4. This is the book I promised in a comment on SS1 in Of Grief and Joy.
5. I will not continue the series without sufficient comments. If I don't get comments I'm going to assume no one is actually reading this through despite what my read count says.
I will try to keep the chapters around a month apart. The reason they can't be closer together is because I'm caught up in school work along with being in the schools play. Please remain patient and don't spam my inbox with questions like "When's the next chapter coming out?" or anything of the sort.
Comments
J.T. Take Your Time
And do the story right. I am glad to see that you are going to post another story here.
May Your Light Forever Shine
May Your Light Forever Shine
Plan A H E A D
If your school plays are in high school, you should be aware that this is an adult site. You're not welcome. If you are an adult, please read on.
You've written the first chapter and you haven't decided if the story will be a tragedy.
What could possibly be wrong with that picture?
Every paragraph, every sentence, every word. . .should advance the story. If you don't know what the story is, how can you subject your writing to that basic test?
Read counts (or hits) don't translate into how many people actually read your story. The next time you're in a bookstore take notice of how many people pick up books, read the dust covers, and then the first page or so, only to leave the book on the shelf. Much the same happens online.
Also, on this site, every time someone opens the story to read the comments they count as a hit. Every time you or someone else opens the story to edit the text, it counts as a hit.
If a person is reading your story, and does so in multiple sessions, each time they come to it they're a hit.
If one of my novels gets 1,000 hits on this site I estimate that two to three hundred people probably actually read the whole story. Out of those two to three hundred, somewhere between four to ten of them will take the time to comment and/or vote. It amazes me how few readers vote for stories. I recently posted a story that had been held for sale on this site. It sold several dozen copies, yet it only received nine votes from over a thousand hits. Go figure.
Deciding whether or not you're going to continue a story based on hits is probably a poor plan. Listen to your muse. If she goes silent for an extended period of time, you might want to stop gawking at a blank screen.
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)
Just A Reminder
Just a quick reminder, Angela, that there are 18-year-olds in high school. This time of year, lots of the senior class would be 18, and in some jurisdictions, some of the junior year as well.
This site is not restricted by educational level, only by age.
Another Quick Reminder
For every 18-year old there are six, seven, or eight in high school who aren't that old yet. I don't make the laws -- but I live in fear of them, and you should as well.
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)
Screw the hit counts Angela, just face the facts...
Who cares? The story has gotten so many hits because people wanted to what? Read the comments and respond to them like on this very blog posting? Damn right! In that case they deserve the hit counts they receive. It was their story that caused all the commenting in the first place!
Why do some stories get very few hits? People read it and leave. No comments, no need to go back and read anything for any reason other than a desire to re-read the story. Quality, maybe so, but no one felt anything, not enough to leave comments. I guess the stories you're talking about are just TOO perfect.
Remember the story Peaches? Now that was a great story, received a ton of hits and comments. Why is that Angela?
Because that story spoke and touched the readership. It compelled them to comment because they actually felt the story! FEELINGS, EMOTIONS, that is what makes a story good, not quality writing skills. If that was the case the Big Closet would have maybe ten stories posted here. NO THANKS! Give me your quality as you did in Peaches and I'll leave a comment or even 20!
Huggles Angela
Angel
You can harp on quality and technical perfection all you want, it don't mean squat for the majority of the readers here.
"Be Your-Self, So Easy to Say, So Hard to Live!"
Angel -- You Loved Peaches Because??
Thank you Angel. Do you suppose you could have made your point without telling me I've wasted thousands of hours working on my skills? I suppose all the college courses I've taken, the over one hundred writing books I've read, the online courses, the honing of skills through editing, etc. has been in vain.
The writing in the original Peaches sucked. I've learned a lot since writing it and have revised it -- and it is much better now.
Peaches proves some of the points I've been trying to make. You loved it because its general themes were in your wheelhouse. A cute boy becomes a "girl."
I don't know how many of my other stories you've taken the time to read. I normally avoid writing sweet/sentimental stories about younger characters.
Peaches got a lot of its comments because Amelia edited for half the world and spent countless hours in chatrooms grooming friends. When it was posted I did it for her benefit as I had already decided comments had nothing to do with quality. Had it been up to me, it never would have been posted.
Amelia is as big a comments and hits whore as I've ever encountered. She once argued with me that we needed to make sure we could check as many themes and elements boxes as possible to attract readers. It was her theory that poeple used search to find stories and would read our story if it contained elements they wanted. This is not meant as being critical of her, as many poeple think hits and comments are important -- like you. You just happen to see a false connect between a good story and hits, comments and votes and I don't.
BTW -- I checked here and at FM. I don't see that you ever commented on Peaches.
You say that feelings and emotions are what readers want. You go on to say that quality and technical perfection aren't important to readers here. How do you think feelings and emotions are conveyed to the reader? Writing skills certainly help.
Peaches was a good story because Amelia and I have innate storytelling skills. We spent over a year working on that story before it was posted. Most stories here are written over night. I've never belittled storytelling skills. But, writing skills are also important. Whether or not readers know those skills are being employed doesn't matter.
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)
Prime Mistake
that you can make JT is to write this story on the premise of trying to get read hits! Too many authors "demand" comments and don't realize that the burden rests on the AUTHOR to craft something worth commenting on. The AUTHOR has to create the story so that it gives the readers some "meat" to chew on, think with lots of things for the readers to comment about. Secondly, the author has to target their audience and write accordingly. Thirdly, the author has to design the plot so that not every little detail is explained out, the point of view is being used correctly and that the story offers the reader something of value. If you write this story, write it for you! Write it from you, for you, and to hell with what other people think. DON'T write it for comments! You go the route of writing for comments you WILL fail! You will get pissed at yourself and at others and... for what? Its so easy to prevent becoming upset and having others being upset at you simply by writing it for you!
Now, having said that, Authors should get comments as it's the only form of payment that they get for posting (excluding publishing). It should occur, but doesn't necessarily happen all the time for a variety of reasons. Some of those reasons include: word choice, length, style, over explaining, plot weakness, dialogue weakness, etc. - well you get the picture. If it happens you do not get comments - LEARN from it! Don't piss around, mope, and make readers and other authors angry - you are only hurting yourself in the end. Learn from it and keep on writing - using the knowledge of why the previous story failed and try something different. Don't give up! It may take you 20 -30 stories to finally nail down just how you want to write and just what and how you want to say. Half the struggle with writing is modifying your style and learning how to get it out so that the people you are trying to get read it will in fact read it and want to.
Heed this advice JT, I have dealt all too often with authors writing for comments and I would like to see you succeed here at BigCloset. But it is entirely up to you. I do hope that you will read this and listen.
Thank You
BigCloset TopShelf
It Bears Repeating
The bear went over the mountain,
The bear went over the mountain, etc.
Your second paragraph suggests a strong correlation between comments and quality of writing. That just isn't how it works. If you want comments, create friendships with other authors. Your clique will comment on and vote for your story.
Some excellent stories using outstanding writing techniques gain almost no comments. I have found no correlation between my better writing and a large number of comments. I have found no correlation between garbage I've written and a small number of comments.
Usually the number of comments depends on things that have nothing to do with quality.
1.) Themes. Certain sub-genre induce more comments. Usually sweet-sentimental stories score big.
2.) Serials. People believe they can influence the course of the plot.
3.) Controversial topics.
4. Bodice rippers. Not so much on BC, but on FM the hotter you write,l the more you will hear from your pleased readers.
Also -- there is NO correlation between quality and number of reads. Note two outstanding stories on BC's front page at the moment -- Dave and the Birds and Gronk. They both have had less than average readership and both are much better than average (excellent) stories.
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)
You & I will go round & round
over this topic Angela. If you write a story and explain out everything and leave nothing to thought from an omnipresent point of view, then there isnt much reason to comment is there? Its quality and substance. Give the readers something to wonder about and some commenting will occur. There IS a correlation between the quality of a story plot, dialogue structure setup, and word choice in many stories visible on BigCloset now and in the past that have everything to do with the composition of quality. Stories such as Camp Kumoni, Marcie Donner's serial, Easy as Falling off a Bike, Becoming Christina Chase - all have differring yet similar qualities: similar in unique dialogue voicing, bits of mystery, continuing subplots, lots of character interaction and less narrative. They are different in their word presentation for dialogue as each author speaks differently from another, different in how the overall story flows (some long and slow, others fast).
Yes there are stories that don't garner comments. Factors that might play into lack of comments could deal with anything but most often it comes from the feel of the wording and the story plot & dialogue. If its difficult to read, of course it wont get many comments. If its an easy read and yet the plot has no mystery, again it may not garner comments. It is entirely in the author's control to figure out the unique formula that works for them to create a story that flows and garners comments based to the audience to which they write.
Again as well, know your audience. The story you mentioned Angela does have a target audience. It appears it was not large, yet the story spoke and worked. It didnt garner many comments; but was the story over explained or its style out of the mainstream? Even if it isn't, look again towards the audience. There are a lot of sweet sentimental readers here on TopShelf, and yes if you write to that audience, you will most definately garner some comments. Romances too. Other genres garner comments based on uniqueness, story topic controversy, and workable offbeat writing style.
If you want the reward of comments, you have to take the risk of many stories not working until you find the style and audience that achieves what you want.
BigCloset TopShelf
Nope
Imagine having spent two to three months writing a story and receiving only a handful of comments. Couple that with people like you suggesting there is a correlation between quality and quantity of comments, or as some have suggested, number of hits.
It just isn't so; and the sooner writers realize that, the better.
Writers should strive for excellence, but should do so for personal pride and accomplishment, not for comments or hits.
When you walk out of a theatre and someone asks you how you liked the movie do you ever say, "Well the screenwriter tied up all the loose ends so I really don't have anything to say"? It's called denouement and it's essential.
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)
I agree with Angela on this one!
Quality or the technicality of writing skills has no bearing on popularity as you can read in my "HINTS" comment.
Some quality writing (not to be confused with likable or popular writing) is overlooked for more than a few reasons.
Some of these reasons Angela has mentioned, but a few more are the "Key Words" and "Categories" selected, and the style of writing.
I have found over the years that the readers want stories they can put themselves into and relate with more than 'Quality, Technically-gifted, Written' stories.
People come here to find the "OTHER" stories, if they wanted the close to perfectly written ones, they would go to the bookstore and buy one.
HINT...
I've read a few stories before they were edited and proofed and they read much better before the editing! Stories can be overly edited making them lose the very fabric of the story to make it 'technically correct.' Through the editing the emotions and the heartfelt aspects of the story were lost. To me, those two elements are very important for a popular story.
The key word(s) for this site is "POPULAR" or even "CONTROVERSIAL" to achieve an official 'hit' your going to have to include emotions in a way that the reader
'feels' your story and characters, at least the main character(s).
That is what produces the comments JT! People "FEEL" something when they read your story and those "FEELINGS" make them comment.
You piss them off, they're going to comment! You make them cry, they're going to comment! Very few comments are left for the story as a whole, usually they are left for certain aspects or sections of your story. GIVE IT THEM!
Use what you know and use what you feel to write a story and 99 time out of 100 you'll have popular story that practically make people comment. (No Promises, but I do know what I'm saying here JT.)
Um, take it easy on our Mom (Erin) though and follow the rules for this site.
Angela is right, 'Quality does not equal popular.'
Huggles and good luck JT!
Angel
"Be Your-Self, So Easy to Say, So Hard to Live!"
Giggle, giggle...HINTS for you JT
If you want comments, piss off the moralists in some way. You'll be guaranteed more comments than you ever wanted!
Use pre-teen children, no need for any sex what so ever, um, have the mother give the child a bath. That's enough for them.
Include religion in a negative way, you know add some reality in the mix.
Politics is always good, bash the progressives in some way, you'll get comments!
Now, they might not be all positive comments, but you'll get comments! You'll also learn who the realists are on this site and who the dreamers are.
Hey, are you one of those that believe as the Mayans(SP?) did, that the world ends in 2012?
Just a question...
Huggles JT and I wish you all the success and I hope your story is a hit!
Angel
"Be Your-Self, So Easy to Say, So Hard to Live!"
Clarification
I am not basing whether I continue the story on hits.
I'm ignoring the hits altogether.
I'm going to base whether or not I continue the story on the CRITICAL REVIEWS that i receive for a chapter.
Basically I'm looking for literate fans that want to help encourage my muse.
Ah, the secret to sucess, online at least
To quote Angela,
>>
1.) Themes. Certain sub-genre induce more comments. Usually sweet-sentimental stories score big.
2.) Serials. People believe they can influence the course of the plot.
3.) Controversial topics.
4. Bodice rippers. Not so much on BC, but on FM the hotter you write,l the more you will hear from your pleased readers.
>>
end quote
So if I write a sentimental tale about a busty woman finding her long-lost childhood sweetheart, a priest who looks like Fabio in his prime, and they, over a series of dayly chapters, consumate their lust while working for the Republican party to infiltrate PETA to undermine it from within into endorsing vivasection, I would have potental goldmine, count wise, on my hands.
And if you can make sense of that last sentence, I'd be astounded. Write for youself first BUT do your reader the courtsey of making the story coherent both in plot and in technical details. Chek yur spellung, don't, miss,use comas. Incomplete sentences must be avoided at.
I.E. proof read it and get help if you must, I sure do.
And be nice in formating your story. Few things spoil my enjoyment of a story than huge continuous blocks of text with no breaks. I find more than say ten lines in a row without a paragraph break -- an actual blank line -- is hard to read on a monitor and only a little better on paper.
Best of luck.
John in Wauwatosa
John in Wauwatosa
"CRITICAL REVIEWS" Oh geeze, then it is up to...
the key elements, the key words, and the categories you select to join the title of your work.
Many people here check those first and choose by those few things if they will read that story or not. So, pick them carefully and if they change from one posted chapter to another, make sure you change the key words and categories as well.
People are strange creatures JT, especially the people who are members here and those that choose to visit here often. I'm a prime example of being a strange person and member here! Giggle, giggle...
Anyway, if your story is not about old farts 'seniors' or people all ready in their forties, and fifties, I'll read it! (I do read any and all stories for contests though, they seem to be the cream of the crop as they are a challenge to the authors here to really go for it!)
Really now, who wants to read about an old flabby guy with balding hair going through transition? The visuals make me ill! He turns into an old flabby woman with perfect faux tits and a super tight vagina. WHOOPEE! Giggle, giggle.
Of course that's my own humble opinion on the matter. I'm a very visual person when I write and when I read if the author paints a picture in words it makes it easier.
I have found that the more popular stories are those that describe humans in transition of one way or another for the age categories of; pre-teen, teen, and twenties, a few in their thirties can be written well enough as well.
One senior story that I read (In a contest) was excellent! The visuals were not that great in my mind, but the way the story was written made it all fit and it was a great story! Here is the title and it was written by one of our more talented authors, Aardvark. You can't miss reading Aardvark's stories!
The Improbable Tale of Colonel Reginald Leyton-Smyth (ret) (Mrs)
Anyway, good luck and I'll wait to see what Key Words and categories you select! Giggle, giggle...
Huggles JT
"Be Your-Self, So Easy to Say, So Hard to Live!"
JT - If You Really Want To
You're writing a story about a class reunion. Despite Angel's age bias, you probably should read my story "And It Feels So Good."
Despite her comments it conveys both feelings and emotions.
Read it and you decide.
**
I asked Erin and she tells me you and the "Real JT Barker" aren't the same person. She also tells me you aren't underaged. Good luck on your story. I hope my PM helped.
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)