I wanted to share something that's been on my mind. I've now published over fifteen times on BCTS, and it's been a bit disheartening.
All I desire is for people to enjoy my work and share their thoughts. If there's something I'm not doing right, I'd really appreciate your feedback to help me improve. Is it the type of stories I write? My writing style? My charachters? It's tough not getting much help on that front.
Envy is an ugly feeling, but I can't help but feel that way when I see all the other stories racking up kudos. Envy can be a powerful motivator to get better, but only when I know how to get better. When I know what YOU the readers want.
I'm not looking for recognition or validation. I am just hoping to connect with readers and hear what you all think. I WANT to get better and I’m not going to stop writing, but I just needed to express how I'm feeling. Thanks for listening.
Comments
Being Discouraged
First. Don't be! Your stories are worth reading and I'm sure you will hit the 'BC Vibe' soon. Readers here are a funny lot and some of your stories have required them to 'Think'. If you just write about young boys and men becoming sweet, beautiful young girls and loving the change you will soon gain a following, but that's just pandering to the crowd.
Check out some of the best writers here, and you may be surprised at how small their audience is and how few kudos and comments they receive. I won't name names, but they keep on writing, probably just for the love of it.
Like 'Sympathy For The Devil' Ive been around for many a long year and I have yet to find that magic formula. Some of my own favourite stories have crashed and burned and some that I thought I just threw out to pass the time have been much better received than I thought they deserved.
I have read and commented on some of your postings and I think you have lots of talent. One day you will strike the jackpot. Please don't give up.
I understand completely
I write for another periodical and am disappointed by the lackluster respose I get in spite of the work I put into it. Some tell me my work is great but when I have pressed, people they can't tell me much about what I have written.
Unfortunately, I'm on the side of Fakeminsk, that your work just isn't my thing. There are a number of authors on BCTS that I simply don't read for the same reason. Joannebarbarella is right, you'll get your audience but it may take some time for them to find you. I don't think you should give up too easily.
>>> Kay
Write for yourself
whatever makes you happy and proud of what you write.
If you write about (I'm being stereotypical here), proms, homecoming and all that US centric teen stuff, you will get an audience but will it challenge you as a writer? Possibly not.
For me, part of writing is the challenge of tackling new topics and all the challenges that they pose.
I try to write about real people and the problems that they have in life. Sometimes, I hit it on the nail. Sometimes, it goes off like a damp squib even though I may have had a lot of fun writing the story. That's life.
A lot of stories here are pure fantasy and I tend to pass them by. Once upon a time, I loved Science Fiction and Fantasy. I read C.S. Lewis as a child but now? No thanks. We as people change and our tastes change over time. That's life.
If what you are writing is not getting a wide audience then why not try something else. This site is very different from other TG sites. Most of us here don't like forced fem whereas those stories are standard fare for other sites. You may even find that those other sites are a better fit for your work.
Whatever is the case, don't stop writing. You will develop a style that you like and are pleased with.
Samantha
Don't be downhearted
At least you have been honest by including aspects covered in the heading information.
Personally (like SamanthaMD's comment) I am not into Sci-fi, and Fantasy, which is what most of your headers list, so I don't even bother!
Similarly (though you mayhave never given such advance warnings) have even less interest in the Supeheroes brand of fantasy, from which (metaphorically) I run a mile!
But there are many other BC readers for whom these are not anathema, (indeed, at the very least you should be read by your fellow authors who use these themes). Please continue for all those (who may even be a majority). BC's guide-lines are very wide-ranging, even allowing the occasional inclusion of stories which are non-tg or non-tv.
Dave
I published for years before,...
I joined the site nearly 20 years ago. Though I'd published else where; first on my own site, then on Storysite and Fictionmania, I didn't publish here until 2006. For years, I muddled along writing what I call "fluff" pieces. Mostly could have been, should have been, wish it had been, stories pulled from bits and pieces of my life. It was a kind of therapy. I wasn't received well, but it didn't matter to me. These were stories that were in me and I had to write them.
Then, a contest came up and something about the parameters of the contest tickled my muse. The result was a short story that I whipped out in record time. (For me that is. I tend to me an on again, off again, kind of writer.) I thought it would just be another story for the contest. Somehow, it won. That was the break point. because it was the winner, many people who had been giving me a pass read it, liked it and then read my other work. From that, I gained a following. It's a small group but I can count on them to read and kudo, if not comment.
Many authors here write and post chapter by chapter and live for the comments. For them the comments help guide the story steering it slightly and feeding the author's creative nature. I can't do that. For a long while, I couldn't bring myself to even read the comments. One of my pet peeves is unfinished serials. I'm sure if I did that, I'd be one of those writers who leave stories hanging. Witness the number of unfinished stories in the bone pile on my hard drive.
Like you I hit a point of wondering how I could increase a positive response to my stories. I analyzed my stories and determined to write more stories along the lines of those that did well. My muse rejected the idea and gave me stories that did anything but copy the themes of what I'd been "successful" at.
In the end, I just have to write what interests me. If others like it great; if they don't, well I liked it or I wouldn't have published it.
Hugs
Patricia
Happiness is being all dressed up and HAVING some place to go.
Semper in femineo gerunt
Ich bin ein femininer Mann
Dear Monkey
I write for me. I’ve covered the gamut of fantasy, science fiction, and small vignettes. I’ve found that this readers here are best. But, I judge my stories popular this way: if ten percent of my readers leave kudos, they like it.
When I write a short story and post it here, it’s because I got it in my head. If I’m happy with the story, that’s my reward. If I get kudos or the occasional comment, I read and respond to each.
When I begin a novel here, twice the amount of people read the first chapter than the second. Sometimes I loose another percentage at the third chapter. I enjoy the comments but it’s not why I write.
My characters talk to me. I hear them like musical ear worms. I started another Wildcats story because I love my Cats and needed to keep them alive.
I guess I’m crazy.
How to get better as a writer
I haven't gotten much advice here on BCTS on how to write better. At least, the suggestions weren't given as advice. They usually arrived as criticisms, and naturally they weren't always welcome.
One significant suggestion came almost right away: that my chapters were way too short. Honestly, I was offended, but it was true, and so I set to work on that... and found, over the years, that there was an underlying issue: I wasn't creating images or scenes in my stories. I was just writing words. In fact, years later, when I was more ready to hear it, someone commented on my very first story that they'd tried to read it, but couldn't "because it was a big mess of words." Now I'm able to see it too.
Okay, so that one was good. It helped. Not all negative comments are created equal.
On the whole, though, pot-shots aside, no one here at BCTS (that I recall) gave me tips on how to *improve* my writing.
In fact, I found a secret consolation in the negative comments: I'd tell myself, "None of them said I'm a bad writer."
I'm sure that over the years I *have* gotten better as a writer. Not great, just better. Everybody can be better.
What did I do?
- I read pieces by people who write better than I do. I don't analyze them; I just drink them in.
- When I'd become aware of an obvious defect, I tried to work on it. Plot, for example. I'm pretty weak at plotting. I wrote some stories that were essentially exercises in plot. I'm better now, but not yet good enough to set up a mystery or a thriller.
- I developed a system of organizing my notes so that I don't lose ideas, dialog, names, characters, quotes, scenes...
- I also found a way of writing outlines that works for me
- When I'm out walking, and an idea hits me, I jot it down on my phone, and later move those notes into my organized system. A lot of the time a walk is the best way to work out a knot in a story.
- I write a lot of crap. If you want to write well, you have to clean out the pipes, so to speak. You get better at writing by writing. If you want to be good, you have to practice. Sometimes you need to write three chapters or more to discover that you're barking up the wrong tree.
- I write every weekday. If I could, I'd write every day, but weekends belong to my family.
I write at least an hour each workday. I am for four, but it isn't always possible. (I have a job.) There are days I spend eight hours straight, writing. If I get stuck, I'll organize my notes and sketch out the current scene or the next one. I find that when I'm stuck it's because my ideas aren't clear to me.
Also, I don't expect to write like Ernest Dante Shakespeare on the first draft. I rewrite A LOT. I have no problem blowing away completed chapters and starting over from scratch, especially if it's chapter one. It's faster to write it a second time than to wade in and make extensive renovations. If I'm going to blow away a chapter, though, I will go through and reduce it to a series of short notes, and maybe a line or two of dialog, if it's particularly good.
Anyway, I'll give your stories a read, flyingmonkey. At first glance, you've got a very readable, inviting style. Hopefully you'll get more attention.
- iolanthe
Solving your dilemma
Dear i
I'm getting mixed signals from your post. I am taking the high road and giving you some links you can read for guidence.
I think you have the right attitude, but expect the readers here to become your mentor, editor, etc.
Instead, I've linked several articles you might read.
I'm here for you.
Leslie Moore
https://www.masterclass.com/categories/writing-3?campaignid=...
https://www.wikihow.com/Write-a-Good-Story
https://www.grammarly.com/blog/how-to-write-a-story/
Solving your dilemma?
Hi, Leslie -- was your "Solving your dilemma" post meant for me? If so, I think you may have gotten the impression that my post was directed at you. It wasn't. I was replying to "flyingmonkey". Since I posted after you, my post happens to be below yours, but isn't connected at all, except that we were both replying to flyingmonkey.
I'm not asking or expecting readers or other writers to offer me help or instruction. I've been posting stories here for over 15 years (mostly as Kaleigh Way), and was trying to tell flyingmonkey that I didn't think other readers or writers were likely to offer guidance, at least not directly.
I hope I'm not misunderstanding your comment... but in any case it was kind of you to offer help.
hugs,
- iolanthe
First ask yourself
"Why do I write?"
Money? (why post at BCTS?) Just for the fun of it? I have a message that I need to tell the world? Ambition to become a great writer just fo rthe sake of being a great author? To entertain others? The good feeling positive feedback gives? ...
For most of us it's a combination of factors but one or two predominate.
The answer leads to a variety of different paths forward.
I know that more than one writer here take writing courses.
Other just bang out stories on instant inspiration and don't give a damn about improving oneself.
I can't say what would work best for you.
I DO know that envy is not very constructive. I know from personal experience. I do envy the kudos count a poster here got a couple a years ago.
Most uncomfortable and not very constructive. Actually the very opposite. The problem is that I just can't get that pesky author out of my mind.
Who?
That very irritating Bru.
So you see, you are not alone in your insecurities.
PS
A tip about a safe bet how to get many hits on the Kudos button: Dress code stories!
There certain story categories that I (must) avoid ...
Over the last six+ months or so, I have found that my general mood and contentment is better if I very sharply limit the amount of 'bad stuff' coming in to my life.
I even have my computer set to warn me a few minutes ahead of the news, so I can turn off the radio. Then I don't hear of the current wars, earthquake, famine, political events & 'stupids' ...
So I do, and I need to, take the warnings and cautions on the stories here seriously.
Stories warning of r-pe, bullying, suicide, heavy duty coercion or non-consent, violence, or other "icky" things ... Sorry, I might not read even the first paragraph. And, sometimes, I will 'bail out' if such start to appear. Lastly, I know how female and male "plumbing" works ... but detailed descriptions of the 'water-works' ... Uhm, Eew! Just no..
Perhaps I am feeling my age, but I am becoming reluctant to begin reading a novel(la)-length story. Maybe if I know and like that author's other work ...
I think for many readers, we have: "Could I have some more 'X', please?" and "Thank you warning me to not read about 'Y'." And X and Y are different for each of us. And can change over time.
---
For me, a comfortable chapter or section length seems to be about 6,000 words. After about 7,000 words, the background in my mind slowly changes from "Great! Keep going." to "Are we there yet?" and eventually "Why did I even start ... ?" Marking internal chapters or sections (within a single post on BCTS) can reduce my reading fatigue.
---
"... envy ..." One famous musician told a wanted-to-be-student "I can teach you to be a second-rate 'me', but why, when you can become a first rate 'you'." The disappointed not-student became equally famous in his own right ...
It would be very hard to match Ricky's conversational repartee, Bru's 'trademark' last paragraph plot twists and reversals, or Bailey Summer's sometimes unfinished breathless sentences where all the emotion goes ...
So, what we are 'stuck' with is that I 'have to' write like the best 'Alan' (me) that I can, and you 'have to' write like the best flyingmonkey that you can.
---
Now that I've sounded pretty down and negative ...
There are many, many stories here that reliably give me "happy tears" (and sometimes sad), even on 2nd, 3rd ... readings. Some are simply delightful romps. Some take me into the (not always imaginary) worlds of the author. Some stories leave me "gasping for breath" at the end.
I almost always leave a "kudo" on the stories I finish reading.
Sigh, most of the time, I don't leave a comment. Sorry.
I recognize the skill of the authors, and have an inkling of the effort they put into the writing. It's clear that many authors have put true bits of themselves into their stories. I did, in one of my stories here. It's clear with some authors that English is not their first language ... but the story overrides their glitches.
One side bonus: Some stories are set in real places, and the "wonders of the internet" let me go there and 'walk' around!
=== ===
Keep writing, especially the stories you 'need' to write; the ones that please you; The ones you think we will like (many of mine); the stories that 'demand' to be told; the stories where the only way to get them "out of your head" is to write them. And, sigh, some stories need to stay encrypted on our disk drives.
And it's a joy for us readers to watch an author get better and better.
Getting Better
You state you want to "get better" as a writer. That is a nebulous goal.
You've been here for over a decade. During that time, I've posted at least a dozen times that there is very little correlation between the number of kudos or hits and story quality. That is simply fact, based on my understanding of what makes a good story.
Your writing is technically in the top five percent of what is posted here. There is little room or need for improvement in that area.
Erotica is not as popular on Big Closet as on other sites. That has been the case for as long as I've been here . . . about twice as long as you.
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I have over twenty books published on Amazon. One officious bitch posts reviews on most of my offerings. She averages three stars. My books receive an average of 4.3 stars.
Why does she continue to buy and review my books? Judging from her remarks and the books she gives five stars, she is looking for stroke fiction and finds inadequate stimulus in what I write.
Cum what may. I'm not going to change my writing to please her tastes. I'm going to continue to try to ignore her.
That might be what you should do. Ignore the lack of positive response to your writing on BC.
I've entered several writing contests on BC. The winners for most of them were selected by voting by the BC readers. I've never won any contest where the winner was selected by general voting. One of the times I did win my winning was based on the percentage of readers who finished my serial. To me, the quality of writing is directly correlated with the ability to hold an audience.
For you to "get better," you simply need to be more self-satisfied.
SELF!
Jill
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)
Writing and being self-satisfied/confident
Well said, Angela.
I do sympathise with people who are looking for "more" in the responses to their writing. One of my pieces gets very little response, at least for me, but I really appreciate the response I do get. And I would say I am someone who's satisfied with their writing, not in the sense it can't be better but that I've reached the point where I know the quality is there. It's not genius level writing, but few authors can achieve that. But for me, in my eyes, my writing is decent.
Why I sympathise with authors who don't have that feeling is it took me a long time, and a lot of work, to get to that level satisfication with my own work. Part of that is the ability to look at your writing and know what its failings are. Where the improvements would be, what you can improve, and what you can do better. That needs feedback, but it can be very hard to get that feedback. Not all feedback is equal, just like all authors aren't equal (outside of being human and having written something.)
Another part of it is knowing only you can really judge your own writing. Readers and authors are separate. And it takes confidence, mainly built through experience to be able to look at a negative comment and laugh at how wide of the mark it is (and sometimes it takes arrogance.) Equally halfway between those two states, of negative response and dismissal of a negative response, is being able to say, "OK, my writing simply isn't for you/this reader." I've argued against readers making demands of authors in the past, if not here then elsewhere. The reader owes the author nothing, and the author owes the reader nothing. The work is the work. People have preferences, maybe the writing isn't for everyone. Recognising that as an author and reader is important.
And all of this takes the ability to judge the situation, and make your own mind up. But that's self-fulfilling. If you can do that with an opinion on a piece of yours (or lack of opinion) you can do it with the piece of writing in the first place. And the easiest way to get to that stage is to just write a lot and work on it. While knowing it takes time.
And then there are authors who are self-satisfied and confident and I read their work and it's awful. Nothing I can say will change their minds, but I know my mind. Maybe I am that author to some readers?
Actual feedback on your writing
Your writing is too lurid for me. It's embellished and referential and not grounded in anything real. It's pure fantasy.
I don't know if it's fantasy in terms of themes but that's what I immediately get from your prose. I do not enjoy it.