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Growing up, one of my favourite genres was fantasy fiction- Chronicles of Narnia, Dragonlance, Eye of the World etc. While there are some TG-themed tales set in magical lands, there are not many (at least from what I've seen).
Is there is a quintessential TG-themed fantasy story/novel that I should absolutely read? Is there a reason why there are so few? I would think that this site would be full of them, but there are good reasons (I believe) that they are not abundant.
1) It is hard to write fantasy and even harder to write good fantasy
2) It requires creating not only characters, but villains (loathsome creatures), the world with all of its geography, politics and religion. Setting a story on Earth is far easier.
3) It is very easy to fall into tropes (elves, goblins, dwarves)
I am thinking about trying my hand at writing one, and I'd like to know some opinions on these stories. I have been tinkering with a world that I could set the story in. Are there any traps I should avoid?
Try
Maiden by Decree
Try...
Dim Prisons and Drakes, by me? :)
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You might like
More Weird West than Fantasy
It's a Wild West where magic and steam punkish technology works. Dead Reckoning http://www.mercedeslackey.com/books/dead.html. While not truly TG, one of the three main characters is young woman looking for her missing brother, she is traveling the west disguised as a young male gunslinger. The protagonists use magic, science, to fight off a hoard of zombies.
It is implied that there will be a sequel, but it's been two years. );
fantasy and tg
There are a number of tg themed fantasy stories I can think of...
You may be interested in my Ragnarok Rising series (starting with Incompatible: Birth of a Spellbinder), which is an alternate history tale set in a modern Nyrland which is basically a Norse United States and. The course of history in this story took quite a different path than our own, where magic is real and the technology developed to be pretty steampunk-esque. All my stories can be found on my organizer page: http://bigclosetr.us/topshelf/book/30725/daw
There's also the following stories by Morpheus are Fantasy: Excaliber Principal 1 & 2 which are more contemporary fantasy. His story "The Academy' is a tribute to Harry Potter. Damsel in Distress is more of a Medieval fantasy and the Changling Chronicles is another contemporary tale that's worth reading. All of his stories can be found on his organizer page. http://bigclosetr.us/topshelf/book/32388/morpheus
I don't have a lot of time to discuss writing fantasy and world building, but if you PM me I can get back with you later today or tomorrow.
Have delightfully devious day,
Don't worry about tropes
Tropes exist for a reason because they exist. A sword is a sword is a sword. You can avoid all the tropes that use a sword, by using a non-sword item for a weapon or plot device, but that's just more tropes. Don't fall into the trap of avoiding a trope because it seems common.
I'm writing my Salamander story and there is the world of Jord with elves, dwarves, nereids, and humans. There is also the current world the main character is in similar to our normal everyday world with ninjas, superheroes, and governments with their military and law enforcement. There are also other worlds yet to be seen.
I wouldn't worry about tropes. Worry more about making whatever you need work for whatever you need it for. If your characters need to find a sword of destiny, then they need a sword of destiny to find. If it needs to be a cup, a person, a wand, a throne, or tablets, or whatever, make it that thing. If the whole quest is a waste of time and really just a journey of personal discovery by the main characters, and the sword of destiny is a lie, well that's just another trope.
It's tropes all the way down... which is another trope.
There's no escaping this fact... which is another trope.
Nothing but tropes and prepositional phrases.
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Thanks for the replies everyone
I'll check out the suggestions.
I know that in many cases the tropes cannot be avoided, but I suppose they can be turned on their head. I mean there's a certain expectation when reading fantasy novels that there will be sorcery, swordplay and mythical creatures. I understand too that I have to write what I like, and if that's elves, dwarves etc, then fine.
Thanks again for the suggestions and tips.
Everything's a trope.
People yelling "Norm" on Cheers is a trope, turned into any character saying "hello" more than once is a trope, turned into a character greeting others differently is a trope...
Once something happens twice it's a trope, and if it doesn't then it becomes a trope by breaking the trope.
I wrote a fantasy story called "Quest for the Silver Cleric"
but I embraced the tropes fully ...
(If you're interested, the link is here:)
http://bigclosetr.us/topshelf/book/37108/quest-silver-cleric
By the way, let me take the opportunity to tell you how much I'm enjoying your story.
Earth is Harder for Me
If you want to write a story that focuses on a character's transformation, how it impacts their life, the personal conflicts, and how they interact with the world, it does not really make sense to place it in a fantasy world. Maybe an enhanced earth, which allows the transformation by magic or tech, but you are mostly dealing with how you expect or want people to react. Beyond that, there are lots of other interesting genres, set on a real earth, in which you can introduce a TG character. In general, I don't think the fantasy section is that much smaller here than in a book store.
I think this is true of all genres.
Personally, I find it much easier to create a story in a world other than earth. I can't do what I want to do on earth, I need to be the "god" of my own world, be able to manufacture the rules of the environment. In fact, I feel that the biggest fantasy world I see here is realty, I find myself to cynical to ignore certain rules and create the story I want to create. Better to create my own reality. It also seems that real world conflict leads to more emotional trauma, I would rather balance that with the potential for some physical trauma.
As for geography, it's fun to draw a map and a key early step to world building. With politics and religions, it is not a matter of inventing new types that have never been seen, but moulding and combining the variations available in history books into the model you want. I also do not think your villain need to be loathsome or epic for fantasy.
I hate high fantasy elves. Think they are too stuck up, magical and yet useless for their own good.
That said, fantasy does not need fantastical creatures, just fantastical elements. Not saying you should not use them, they can be fun and introduce a whole section of world building without writing thousands of words. It's just that they are not really needed.
As for tropes, I think a writer needs to be careful ignoring or writing against them. The whole asshole, anti-hero (who is maybe slightly better than all the other shit heads in a world) started as a repudiation of a trope believed to exist, yet has become the most prevalent trope in today's fantasy writing.
Interesting
"If you want to write a story that focuses on a character's transformation, how it impacts their life, the personal conflicts, and how they interact with the world, it does not really make sense to place it in a fantasy world. Maybe an enhanced earth, which allows the transformation by magic or tech, but you are mostly dealing with how you expect or want people to react. Beyond that, there are lots of other interesting genres, set on a real earth, in which you can introduce a TG character. In general, I don't think the fantasy section is that much smaller here than in a book store."
I've written a story that focuses primarily on a character's transformation and particularly how it impacts their life (see The Sidereus Prophecy). The Sidereus Prophecy is fully grounded in reality, where there are real-life consequences for actions. There is magic within but it's not the type you would see within a typical fantasy story. I think it is still wholly possible to do the same in a fantasy world, as long as you establish the world, the existing politics and religion. Once this is established, then you can still explore personal conflicts, interactions with the world and the impact on their life.
What I meant about it being hard to write fantasy is that the manner of speaking is different (or should be in most cases), mannerisms, fashion- it is more complex then plopping a character into present day Earth. Earth is an established playground with a fascinating history. When all of this has to be created, it runs the risk of being poorly conceived (read bad). This is my fear. This is why I believe that it is harder to write. Writing convincing, non-cliched dialogue I believe is also a challenge. These worlds have a mythos about them, gods, expression derived from events, all of which have to be created.
I agree with you about the maps, and the villain. I just meant that a person can be a villain in a story set on Earth, and while this can also be true in a fantasy world, in a high-fantasy setting it is more expected that you will have beasts (which again need to be created.)
It just seems like there's a lot more to do in term of creating a fantasy story. Although I suppose for The Sidereus Prophecy, I did have to research education, law, popular culture, teen culture. I see what you mean about taking established Earth history/cultures and sort of using them to create something. I mean most sword and sorcery is based heavily on the medieval period with Nord, Celt cultures.
I must say I do prefer the anti-hero type. I guess I'm walking right into a cliche. :) Again, I will write what I want of course. thanks for the reply.
ok, late suggestions
The Last Herald Mage Trilogy is a gay main character.
in Oathbreakers trilogy Mercedes Lackey introduces a "forced fem" character [ or in one of the short stories books, using the Oathbreaker's characters ]
She also has that same forced fem character get completely transitioned in another story.
but the list below is the closest to the timeline listing, top of the list is earliest in the timeline.
but the last herald mage trilogy is actually set after the Heralds of the Queen Trilogy, same main characters
with this many titles in the series, you know they are extremely good novels.
and, each trilogy can be read as a stand alone set, with only 1 exception pair, Mage Winds and Mage Storms really do need to be read in sequence.
no tropes [ elves ect ]only gryphons, humans, and "Companions" [ magical horses, not unicorns ]
edit to add:
forgot to mention [ cause it may actually bother some readers ]
Brightly Burning, mc and companion [ the magical horse ] are a love at first site / lifebonded mated pair.
Valdemar universe:
The Mage Wars
The Black Gryphon (1994) with Larry Dixon
The White Gryphon (1995) with Larry Dixon
The Silver Gryphon (1996) with Larry Dixon
The Last Herald Mage Trilogy
Magic's Pawn (1989)
Magic's Promise (1990)
Magic's Price (1990)
The Last Herald Mage (1990 - omnibus)
The Collegium Chronicles
Foundation (2008)
Intrigues (2010)
Changes (2011)
Redoubt (2012)
Bastion (2013)
Brightly Burning (2000)
Vows & Honor
The Oathbound (1988)
Oathbreakers (1989)
Oathblood (1998)
Vows and Honor (1993 - omnibus)
Exile's Honor (2002)
Exile's Valor (2003)
Take a Thief (2001)
Kerowyn's Tale
By the Sword (1991)
Heralds of Valdemar
Arrows of the Queen (1987)
Arrow's Flight (1987)
Arrow's Fall (1988)
Queen's Own (1987 - omnibus)
Heralds of Valdemar (1990 - omnibus)
The Mage Winds Trilogy
Winds of Fate (1991)
Winds of Change (1992)
Winds of Fury (1993)
The Mage Storms Trilogy
Storm Warning (1994)
Storm Rising (1995)
Storm Breaking (1996)
The Owl Mage Trilogy
Owlflight (1997) with Larry Dixon
Owlsight (1998) with Larry Dixon
Owlknight (1999) with Larry Dixon
Valdemar Short Story Collections
Sword of Ice (1997)
Sun in Glory (2003)
Crossroads (2005)
Moving Targets (2008)
Changing the World (2009)
Finding the Way (2010)
Under the Vale (2011)
Valdemar Companion (1990) with John Helfers
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