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This will be a general forum for writers and interested readers to comment on and discuss writing in general and TG writing in particular. This first topic will be for discussing what other sorts of topics or subforums we need. :)

New: me, content... Help!

Hi!
Michelle Wilder here.
I've written occasional stories through the years, often with TG theme and content (subjectively, at least) and would like advice, help, and all that, as I think I'd like to contribute some of them. I admire the work of many of the authors here at BC, and can think of no better feedback than from them or their readers.
I'm a pretty good copy editor (newspapers) so I'd be glad to reciprocate your help.
Sincerely,
Michelle

Forum.

It sounds super. Love to help if needed.

Topic - Resources

I would recommend a section for links, periodically re-validated, to resources useful for writers.

As a 'seed', I offer a link given me by Amelia_R:

http://cctc.commnet.edu/grammar/

Nicole (a.k.a. Itinerant)

--
Veni, Vidi, Velcro:
I came, I saw, I stuck around.

Writer's Resources Links

erin's picture

Good idea. Links for writer's can now be found here. Future links can be added with the |Add Link| choice in the top menu.

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

Editors and proof readers

Perhaps we could establish a Central listing of those ready to assist authors in such a way. It seems to be a need that crops up fairly regularly.

I confess that for my part I have never seen the need. Too arrogant to contemplate anyone changing my own deathless prose, and too uncaring to bother about readers who cannot stomach the ocassional typing error.

I take the view that as I am an amateur writing for my own pleasure, any inconvenience of the reader is a secondary consideration. I belong firmly to the 'Publish and be Damned' school of thought. It does however seem that others are put off posting their own stories because of the lack of such revision. And this I consider a great shame. The mechanics should not overshadow the spirit.

What do others feel about this? Not on the possiblity/probability that my own work might not benefit from editing etc., (It probably would but then I feel it wouldn't be mine, and I shall react in a surly manner, tinged with disbelief, to those who express relief at this), but on the general topic of the importance/advisability/need of such.

Yours,

Fleurie

Fleurie

Good Topic

erin's picture

Proofers/Editors Wanted/Offered to add to forum.

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

My two cents ...

... on the subject of editors and proofreaders is simple. Those who feel they need them should have access to them. Those of us who choose to fly without a 'chute -- well, sometimes that's part of the fun tool. *smile*

As a professional writer (albeit in marketing and advertising), I've had my work reviewed and changed by others throughout my career. Changes are made, and clients go away happy -- primaarily because I have no deep emotional commitment to the work other than to ensure that the client is satisfied and the creative concept is sound and executed to the best of my ability (client comments notwithstanding). *smiles*

With fiction, it's difficult for me to turn my work over to someone else because it's my work. The characters are my people, and their story is my story.

But the bottom line is that when your work is out there being read by your audience, they will be judging it based on how well it does its job. If the essense of storytelling is to bring your readers into the world you create and let them live in it through your characters, that is the one true measure of your success. However, if typos, grammar, or continuity errors get in the way of that mission, your story won't be told properly. No writer wants that to happen.

For me, I do my best to edit my stories before I post, and take the extra effort as part of the process. And there ARE good editors out there -- folks who read and polish without leaving their own mark on the work. They suggest, but never impose.

They check their egos at the door -- which, I guess, is why a good editor is so hard to find.

*hugs*

Randalynn

LADY: Well, how did you become king, then?
ARTHUR (with great reverence): The Lady of the Lake, her arm clad in the purest shimmering samite, held aloft Excalibur from the bosom of the water signifying by Divine Providence that I, Arthur, was to carry Excalibur. That is why I am your king!
DENNIS: Listen. Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony!
-- Monty Python and the Holy Grail

Editors

Breanna Ramsey's picture

As Randalynn said, there are good editors out there. I can not say enough about how my editors have helped me with my first major story, Genomorph (shameless plug).

In addition to catching my punctuation errors (I am getting better...I think), I find it of immense help just to have someone read the story and say, 'You know, I'm not sure what you are saying here', or something similar. I get so involved in the world I have created that I sometimes neglect to convey things that I take for granted...because, of course, I know everything that is hapenning.

I was very fortunate that Janet and Carla responded to my request for editorial help. I know that I have told a better story because of them.

Scott

Bree

The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense.
-- Tom Clancy

http://genomorph.tglibrary.com/ (Currently broken)
http://bree-ramsey314.livejournal.com/
Twitter: @genomorph

Call 4 Editing

When I went to high school everyone thought I was a boy -- well, almost everyone. Boys took Latin, Physics, and Calculus. Girls giggled their way through French and typing; and they also stayed awake in English. Latine Dicem?

Sometimes I know exactly what I want to write, but my fingers don't cooperate. I stare at the keyboard while trying to find those darned letters, and push my kitty to the side -- occasionally. I often miss errors (or put on airs, whichever is the case).

I love to edit other poeple's work as much as I love to write. It's the buttinski in me coming to the surface. Call me, I'm in the book.

Angela Rasch (Jill M I)

Angela Rasch (Jill M I)

Writer's Forum

Just to add a few thoughts and warnings:

An author felt personally insulted when I met her complaint of not being able to find an editor with enough time on his hands to edit her novel-length stories with a suggestion that she learn grammar and self-edit to the extent she could. There is nothing wrong with learning (or relearning) grammar: it's not rocket science, and your editor or proofreader, if you decide to use one, will love you for the effort.

Don't go to different places on the net for grammar tips, as I did; it's worth than useless, and will only make you crazy, as the rules often contradict each other. I'm still recovering from grammar disonance. There are several schools of grammar. Find one and stick to it.

Do read "Elements of Style" and understand its basic concepts. It will save you a lot of time and effort should you decide to write anything halfway serious.

Although a few libertarian writers disagree with me, I'd say that it's a wise investment to buy a decent book on writing. Even if you choose to ignore the "rules," as some describe it, writing books provide a lot of general tips on how to energize dialogue, develop characters, develop plots, and so forth, which will make you think, at least.

Aardvark

"Happiness is when what you think, what you say, and what you do are in harmony."

Mahatma Gandhi

Elements of Style

Whilst I suspect I am one of the writers referred to in the last paragraph, Aardvark and I having had an enjoyable private joust on the subject before, I do support his concern over grammar. In the UK however this has not featured in the school curriculum for several decades, it being presumably regarded as too difficult and as an obstacle to the creative expression.

Few in the U.K. are therefore currently capable of recognising a grammatical structure and thus its practice has largely fallen into disrepute. Only the memory still happily lingers with those who were also taught a *foreign language, preferably a dead one. In the circumstances, unless one attaches some importance to clarity and precision, its importance is arguably marginal.

Nevertheless I would join with Aardvark in encouraging a revival in what seems to be a dying art. And would add to his recommendations Fowler's 'Modern English Usage, Eric Partridge's 'Usage and Abusage' and Sir Ernest Gowers' 'The Complete Plain Words', as being both instructive and amusing.

And I am aware that one shouldn't begin sentences, let alone paragraphs with 'and'. But I quite like doing it. And thus, as is the case generally with things I like, probably do it to excess.

Fleurie

*P.S. I exclude American English from this category, at least for the duration of this posting

Fleurie

"How to Write" books

The books that set out to teach writers are like all other things -- about 20% of them are excellent, another 20% are passable, and the other 60% are awful.

"Why," I asked, "did I plunk down $14.95 for a book on dialogue from on an author who doesn't know what she's writing about?"

I had just waded through the first forty pages of a book on dialogue, when I completely satified my urge to throw the book across the room.

"It appears that book doesn't meet your expectations," my spouse said from the other side of the bed, with all too much calm in a voice quite capable of sudden rage.

"..." I closed my eys and silently began counting to ten, the andrenaline from throwing the book still coursing through my veins.

"You'll have to clean up the mess from that plant you knocked over," my spouse added, not being known for having a compassion side.

I smoothed the folds of my negligee before climbing out of bed to propect for nuggets at my bedside bookshelf. "I never want to be so well-known as an author that I'm tempted to sell my soul writing a writer's guide."

"I'm sure you can manage that," she said without a smile.

Never go to sleep angry; never go to sleep angry, I thought again and again, but it wasn't working.

Angela Rasch (Jill M I)

Angela Rasch (Jill M I)

Great idea!

Love to see this, it's been missing for quite a while.

Would not recommend too many subforums, maybe one dealing with TG writing in general (genre, technique, challenges, etc), and another to discuss posted works.

A section to throw out ideas and test concepts for works-in-progress would be useful

anything I can do

While I am still relitivly new to writing, I would be more than happy to help out in any way I can.

Is posting turned off on JulieO's The Scholarship 3 of 3?

I have tried repeatedly reloading the web page to comment on Julie O's wonderful story and cannot get the comments to come up even though the comment header to post shows up in the story. Is it off?

Also I could not find the help forum to ask a question like this so I am not sure this is the right spot.

Sephrena Miller

Fixed comment flag in Scholarship Part 3

erin's picture

It was off. This is a software bug that bites various auhots some of the time and a few authors almost all of the time. I'm going to have Abe Lincooln look into it. :)

This is as good a spot to mention it as any other, Sephrenam though maybe FAQ would be better. At any rate, thanks for pointing it out.

- Erin

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

Erin when is next Writer gathering in IRC?

Please, can you tell us when you can schedule another gathering time?
I think Some authors need meet and discuss things like values, what things we are doing and what we want on BC. Please?

Sephrena

Next BC Chat will be announced...

erin's picture

...tonight or tomorrow. :) I'm working on what we'll be talking about now.

It's certainly possible for someone else to use the BC chat rooms, they're open.

Hugs,
Erin

= Give everyone the benefit of the doubt because certainty is a fragile thing that can be shattered by one overlooked fact.

Show Support to Authors for Stories That You Read

I know this has been said many times, but seriously, it is important to let the author know they made a difference in your mind by what they wrote. If you read the story and you liked it or the series it belongs to as a whole, please find something to say. It does not take a whole lot of time to do and means so much to them and is little to ask for if they have touched you inside in some way!

Please spread the holiday cheer and make an author happy today! Write a comment! *hug*

Sephrena Miller