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There are some things I have to say because I see people drawing conclusions on stories that are not completed. The first part of a story sets up the characters and the plot, and the second part sets up how the characters interact with each other, and the third part just goes with the plot full force. But to draw a conclusion in a comment before the story is finished is like a newspaper reporter making up his/her own story because he can't get an interview; like in Football Girl. But there are reporters in real life who actually do do that.
Comments should be about the story, and not include about the personal battles the commentor went through in life. Why do we write in the first place? We write to entertain others, not to be slammed because somebody misread part of the story and drew the wrong conclusion. In my stories for example, I write about love, acceptance, friendship, happiness, family values, and trust. These are values most TGs look for in the people around them. Whether it is from family, friends, co-workers or other peers, this is what we want in our lives.
Because there are many in our community that don't have any of this, I write about it, because this is what I had in my life, and I let others know that it is possible to have this kind of life. (See my blog The Times They Are A Changing.) So when we read any part of a story, and know that the story isn't finished yet, we should make our comments on that part and not conclude them which many seem to do. Remember ladies and gentlemen, this is not our parents lives we are living but our own, and we must see past that barrier they set up. I was lucky, in a way, that the lady I call my mother in my stories actually accepted me and encouraged me to be the best woman I could be. That is how my stories are. They show that love, acceptance, happiness, and encouragement.
So we don't make concluding comments on a story that isn't finished yet. We just make our comments on that particular section, chapter, or part. And it doesn't matter what kind of conflict we have had in our lives, what matters is the story, whether you think it is not realistic or has some realistic points IS NOT THE POINT. The point is that we write our stories to entertain, and I see by many comments for many different stories that readers are more concerned about realism than entertainment. If you want realism, look our your window, or go to the mall. If you want entertainment, go see a movie, or read a book. The Times They Are A Changing ladies and gentlemen. And these times are changing for the good. Even though we have a long, long way to go, these times are changing, and they are changing for the better. I see it everyday, maybe it is time some of you opened your eyes a little further.
In conlcusion, all I can say is, leave personal opinion out of your comments, and just comment on the story itself. Thank you. Barbara.
Comments
Hopefully...
Forcing comments to DIRECTLY relate to ONLY the text posted will never become a policy on this site.
Do readers "miss-understand" or "miss-interpret" things that we as authors post? Yes. They do this whether our stories are complete or not. Sometimes this is contributed to by how we write. Sometimes it's how they read. It does, and will continue to happen. It happens to published authors. (A good example of this I saw in an interview with William Faulkner. He was asked about the "symbolism" an English teacher had found in one of his books. His reply was that that symbolism was only there for the reader. He'd not put anything meaning anything like that in the book. It was a very light book that he'd written very quickly for the revenue.)
Do we as commenters make mistakes? Also, yes. We miss read something, or read it as written and interpret it one way while the author may have intended an other, and as a result our conclusions are "flawed" with respect to the authors. Some authors INTENTIONALLY put in events/dialog that implies one thing, that the reader can't interpret correctly, until some later point in time where the author provides some critically needed bit of information that lets you re-interpret past events in a new light.
Okay, I believe I've established that a "difference" may well exist in the reader's perception and the author's perception of what is written. Sometimes this difference is intended by the author, sometimes it may be accidental. The source doesn't change that it's there. I can't (nor do I try) speak for all authors or readers. I only speak for myself. If I post something in segments, I can't (or at least I won't) expect readers to refrain from comment or speculation about what has been shown, and what is yet to be shown. Do I prefer them to not attack me personally? Yeah. I'm human, or at least I pretend to be (there's some question about whether this is the case, or whether I'm actually an alien changeling substituted for the original at age 10), and as a result I have feelings that can be hurt.
Some of my stories, I've EXPECTED readers to interpret some characters in a bad light. In a few cases, I've "redeemed" the characters, but not always. I find speculation on what is to come actually helpful. It tells me whether I've put in the clues I think I have. A time or two, speculation raises an idea that I'd not considered, and I decide to address it in the story. These are all possitive things. Once in a while, a reader has made a comment that had me going "huh? where did that come from?" I look - to see if I can find a way to understand the comment in context of what's been posted to date. Sometimes, I see it, sometimes not. I've asked friends if they could see where that came from. In at least one case, I never did figure it out, and as the rest of the commenters didn't have that issue, I decided to ignore it.
Now, to the point about dragging our personal experience into our comments. If we read some of the same stories (You reference Football Girl, so there's at least one) you've had the opportunity to see my comments. I have included personal experience in my comments. I do it for several reasons, sometimes because the bit in the story hits me personally, and I find it easier to say that by relating my experience... Sometimes, I have knowledge that makes me go "wait, what are you saying? I was there, and it's not like that at all. (An example of that was one author's description of a fresh coconut as being about the size of a grapefruit with the very hard brown shell - rather than about the size of an large American football, with a tough (kevlar like) shell and that hard brown shell on the inside. I called her on this error of fact. She considered my comment, and decided that she would leave her reference as is, as she felt her story flowed better that way, and most readers would only have experience with coconuts from the grocers where the outer husk is already gone.) I respect the author's decision. It's her story, and her readers really enjoyed it.
A final point, is that a comment that says much anything is a personal opinion. It's not necessarily an attack on the author, and it should ever be that. Why bother comment, if the story doesn't affect us in some way? If it affects us, why should we not say how it has done so? I really don't understand where you're comming from. Is it that as an author, you don't want to receive this kind of comment? Or is it that as a reader, you don't care what others are going through or living through, and as a result you don't want to read it in a comment because it detracts from your enjoyment of the story? Or is it something completely different? I'd like to understand better why you believe that mentioning past experience in a story comment is a bad thing? My only conclusion right now, is that I'm completely miss-understanding your blog.
Regards,
Annette
Kind of hard to do isn't it.
"There are some things I have to say because I see people drawing conclusions on stories that are not completed. "
From your own comments on On the Flip Side:
"By the time the girls are finished, Lucas will be Lucille or some other name, with the attitude and discipline to go with it."
"I think that by the time Gymnastics is over with and Lucas is accepted into the sorority, he will never want to go back to being the boy his mother thinks he is."
"When is Lucas and "her" mother going to realize that Lucas is more successful as a girl and should stay a girl?"
. . .we should make our comments on that part and not conclude them which many seem to do. . . . "But to draw a conclusion in a comment before the story is finished is like a newspaper reporter making up his/her own story because he can't get an interview"
Commentator
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A Comment Is a Compliment
Some comments are complements and some are compliments. I think what Barbara is saying is she want more of the "i" and less of the "e".
Actually when a commenter is speculating about where the story will go they are paying a high compl(i)ment to the author. They are showing that the author has engaged them. That's good stuff.
When a commenter writes adjunct to the story they could be highjacking the string which is considered poor form for most online posts. However, I would argue that writing about a general theme within a story is also a compl(i)ment to the writer. One of the hardest things for a writer to do is to get acrossed their themes. If they've successfully got the reader thinking, isn't that also good stuff.
One of our most revered presidents often took verbal sidetracks cruising down the coastal highway with Nancy at his side. Our heritage has a strong tradition of digressing. It's what we do best. It's our Tigger-moment.
Perhaps, Barbara, you should forego writing serials if you don't want this kind of digression. I've only written one story that I didn't post in one chunk. Peaches. That was Amelia's doing. Even though we carefuly stated the story was completed and would be posted everyday for seven days, we still had people trying to direct how the story would progress. It is a bit of a slap in the face to an author to have their reader tell them where the story should go. If the author doesn't know, who does? I get where you're coming from.
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)
Angela Rasch (Jill M I)
I agree with most of your comment...
I kinda like it when readers SUGGEST they know where things are going. As you say, it's a compl(i)ment and tells me they're reading and have been engaged. I posted one completed story in 10 parts (& it was my most popular by far). Did readers suggest things were going differently from where I knew it was going? Yes. Did I change any thing in that case? No.
I've only once had a reader tell me that my story was screwed up. That was the spin-off of Karen Page's A New Style of Education. The reader in question told me that my use of "English" was totally wrong, in that I had British kids speaking with American Accents. It hurt, as I'd thought I was doing "okay". But, as the comments persisted (all in PMs) for several postings, I went and found a second UK editor for my work (apparently one wasn't sufficient to make the British speakers British enough). I'd have preferred that the comments been made in a public forum (comment) so others could have weighed in on this. *sighs* Yeah, it hurt, but I was trying to do something that maybe I shouldn't have tried.
Here I am digressing. *sighs* Let me try to get back to the topic raised. Readers that TELL the author what to do? I've not seen much of that, but I'd think that isn't really a welcome comment. Readers that speculate on what's going to happen, on the other hand, that can be a useful comment - as I indicated in my other post.
Annette
Authenticism
...if there was such a word. Consistency is another I'd use here.
If a writer tries to write a story set in a time or place for which she does not have some personal experience, it is possible that she won't get things entirely right.
For small errors, the reader will probably slide over them, particularly if the reader knows that the author is from somewhere/somewhen else.
However, there will come a point where the differences just stand up and bite the reader, particularly if the reader is familiar with those parts/times. In those cases, a small PM to the author can often alert them that they are doing something that either wouldn't happen or would happen differently. I don't see a problem with that.
I had to give up reading a story I found here some while back, set in southern England, because the author made some blatant errors and it totally destroyed the flow of the story for me. Think: if she can get basic details wrong, why should I accept what other premises she puts before me in her story? By not being diligent enough with certain aspects, it cheapens the rest of what might be a good tale.
Oh yes. I should point out that I probably do the above as well. That doesn't stop me trying hard to get it right. Why write a story at all if you can't be bothered to make it consistent?
Penny
Agreement here
absolutely...
I'm completely on board with the speculation comments...they tell me as a writer that I have the audience thinking about whats next...I even throw out small hints amongst the red herrings to see what response I'll get...which is always never enough to feed my desire for feedback.
But at the same time, I do get a little 'peeved' when a comment is almost a hijack, or a readers disappointment that I didn't plot twist the way they expected. I too, typically am writing a chapter 3 or 4 ahead of what I'm posting, and trying to appease someones desire for a specific action to take place means I'm no longer in control of my story...
Natural Byproduct
I agree that it is natural for these type of comments to come when posting a story in a serial fashion. In making the choice to control how their readers will consume a story, authors are asking for a greater commitment from those readers. In return for a reader to have their satisfaction delayed and maybe having to deal with multiple cliff hangers, I believe that author ends up giving away more of their vision than if they plunk it down in front of us and say, here it is.
I've only posted one serial.
I've only posted one serial. I was surprised, and a little dismayed, at the number of people who said that they didn't like femdom stories and wouldn't continue with it. I don't write femdom stories, and this wasn't one either. A number of readers had drawn erroneous conclusions as to the theme of the story after reading just the first part.
I have at least one story under way, that will have to be serialised (due to its size); it'll be interesting to see how that is received. Don't hold your breath, though, as it's unlikely to make it to BCTS until it's complete (or nearly so).
Susie
As a serial serial writer
I enjoy comments of all sorts, even those which fly off at tangents speculating on other's comments rather than my episode. I do throw red herrings or write ambiguously at times to see if I can get readers to draw wrong conclusions before taking them off obliquely in the opposite direction.
As for people contributing life experiences - I welcome them, when I get a comment or pm telling me that a reader can identify with an experience similar to one in my stories, I feel particularly privileged - it validates my own experiences or my imagined experience.
I enjoy doing serials because I interact with the reader while I'm writing them, and to me that is the essence of writing fiction, to engage and draw the reader in to the story - and if they start to care about the characters, that's happening. So when they comment about me threatening or damaging a character, it shows they care enough to say so and I know they'll stay with the story for some time - they are involved in it and that feeds my little ego as well as giving them something.
I use all the tricks I know to keep their engagement, melodrama, action, cliff-hangers, romance, anything except explicit sex - there are people who write that better, and nearly all my stuff is written for consumption by a fourteen year old girl, who happens to enjoy my scribbles, so I keep it clean - besides, I don't like to read that myself, so I write something I might like to read.
Comments help me and I welcome them.
Angharad.
Angharad
Comments on serials
After starting to read a serial and having the author not complete it , I save all parts in hope of having a story to read in total BEFORE I start to read. If the story completes, I'll perhaps read it and THEN make comments. Incomplete stories are in storage.
Chac