The Natural Result of the Bathroom Police

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http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/utah-dad-attacked-taking...

Utah Dad Attacked for Taking 5-Year-Old Daughter to Wal-Mart Men's Bathroom

A Utah father taking his young children to the bathroom at a Wal-Mart ended in violence after he was punched in the face by another customer allegedly over taking his 5-year-old daughter with him to the men's room.

Christopher Adams was on a family trip to buy blinds and storage bins at a Wal-Mart in the city of Clinton over the weekend when his two children, 7-year-old Kyler and 5-year-old Emery, had to use the restroom, he told NBC affiliate KSL.
Christopher Adams with his 5-year-old daughter, Emery, and 7-year-old son, Kyler. KSL

Adams said he took his son and daughter with him into the men's restroom when a confrontation ensued.

"This guy walks in and goes to the bathroom, the urinal, and then he just like turns to me and starts freaking out and dropping the f-bomb," Adams said. "And what he was freaking out about was that my daughter was in the men's bathroom."

Adams said the other man told him he thought Emery's presence in the restroom was inappropriate and started to shove him.

"When I turned back around, I got sucker punched," he said.

Adams said he was punched in the face and kicked in the knee multiple times before he was able to force his assailant out of the restroom.

"I just slammed him to the ground and just held him until associates from Wal-Mart could get there," Adams the distraught dad added.

Clinton Police Lt. Shawn Stoker said the individual who was "determined to be the aggressor" was cited at the scene.
""When I turned back around, I got sucker punched.""

The man, who police declined to name, was cited for disorderly conduct and the city attorney was screening a potential assault charge, according to KSL.

"This is a situation where a father felt the most reasonable and safe thing for him to do was to take his children inside the restroom with him," Stoker told the station.

The other customer "took exception to that," he said.

"I want him to understand that he was in the wrong," Adams added. "The way he handled the situation was completely wrong — I just think it's ridiculous."

Comments

Bathroom Bills

Frank's picture

I know the above story is non TG related (but is it really) However something I have been wondering in all this bathroom BS:

When you are presenting in your real gender identity, it is after counseling and transitioning which isn't a short process. You don't go to school/work as a man, and just one day dress as a girl to scope out the women's restroom. Its a long process and not what those people are supposedly worried about. There are usually accompanying paperwork from a counselor certifying that the person is transgendered and starting their real life test.

{{Hugs}}

Hugs

Frank

Not necessarily.

Not everyone can afford to pay for a shrink, so we do what we can on our own. Sometimes that means starting to live and present in our correct gender without ANY accompanying support or paperwork. I'm one of these.

Abigail Drew.

I agree

Frank's picture

I was trying to figure out a way to include crossdressers in my comment but was having trouble saying it elegantly enough so I chose to leave it out. I hadn't thought about DIY'ers but you are correct in that there are folks who have to go that route for whatever reason. There are places you can go for hormones that just require informed consent and not the whole Benjamin standards routine.

My basic point I was trying to make is that it isn't a whim for someone to dress properly(?) just to scope out bathrooms to see women and/or girls in the act of peeing. Not to mention they could wait right OUTSIDE the bathroom for that matter.

Hugs

Frank

US bathroom wars made UK television

Just watched a good news clip on UK television over the LGBT bathroom born gender usage bans in North Carolina, I hope the more conservative bigoted politicians over here don't decide to follow the example!

It was ridiculous

Angharad's picture

most of us as adults have taken children into the 'wrong' toilet because it isn't safe to send a young child into a public loo by themselves, normally no one takes any notice or they didn't in the days when my kids were young.

I can also remember at a folk festival being asked by a little girl to take her into the ladies because she couldn't find her parents. I was only in my second week of transitioning and was slightly concerned, so I took her to the cubicle and waited outside it while she went, then waited while she washed her hands and then saw her back outside. I gave her protection while she was vulnerable without making myself vulnerable. That was 30 years ago.

Angharad

grandmothers

I can still remember when I was 10 or 11 yrs old , my grandmother would take me and my younger brother in ladies restrooms. no one thought anything about it. you were protecting the children. what a world it is now.
robert

001.JPG

I think you are thinking more of midgets

For those old enough, there were the Little Rascals series, produced in the 1920s/30s I think. There was at least one where a bank robber was dressed up as a baby.

It's a really sad world out there.

I remember

Andrea Lena's picture

one of the kids couldn't get anyone to believe he saw a 'fidget.' Nice to see you, BTW!

  

To be alive is to be vulnerable. Madeleine L'Engle
Love, Andrea Lena

Hey ....

Andrea Lena's picture

isn't that little Lullabye Leaguer Kenny from accounting?

Weeeee represent the transMunchkins' Guild and we just wanna pee sitting down! YASAG!

  

To be alive is to be vulnerable. Madeleine L'Engle
Love, Andrea Lena

Fear

Admittedly I haven't been in the US for a very long time (last time I entered I wasn't even asked to show my passport which shows how long ago it was) but based on primarily US media reports I'm surprised how US society appears to permeated by fear.

Fear Is Primary

About three percent of us do things because we see the positive potential in our actions. The other 97% are motivated primarily by fear of the consequences of not acting.

Politicians are well aware of this and play to those instincts.

I've read a lot of comments on this site about who is impacted by the bathroom laws. Many of those commenting seem to have a narrow perspective of what it means to be transgendered. Most of those views seem to suggest that you aren't TG unless you're transitioning.

That simply isn't so.

I'm trans, but I'll probably never transition because I don't feel the need. It's not fear that stops me from transitioning. I'm definitely in the 3% who make their decisions based on positive potential. I simply don't want to. That might be hard for some here to understand, but you need to try.

About twenty years ago I was in an upscale grocery store and needed to use the bathroom. For some reason my brain slid sideways for a moment and I went into the ladies'. I was doing my business in a stall unaware that I'd made a mistake, when two women walked in. I took stock of my situation. I was wearing panties and pantyhose under my slacks. Otherwise I was dressed in "male" clothing. I would not easily pass. I stayed in the stall until they left and then quickly got out of the restroom. Under these new bathroom laws I would have committed a criminal act. Under the old circumstances I probably only would have been embarrassed, had I been caught.

Trans people cover a wide gamut. There are those on this site who probably think I'm a pervert because I have a need to dress in women's clothing but do not want to transition. That's ironic, because it's quite possible that the vast majority of people in the general pubic would say that it is much more perverted to surgically alter your body to satisfy your trans nature.

I long for the day in the not too distant future when being trans is no more of a social stigma than being left-handed. Perhaps a good first step to that end would be a much stronger effort by everyone on this site to be more compassionate.

Jill

Angela Rasch (Jill M I)

This is why I have a problem with the term transgender

Angharad's picture

It means all things to all men and women. I certainly don't have a problem with anybody not wanting to have surgery or even to be an occasional woman or just enjoying the clothing or other trappings of the other sex, though that is primarily dominated by men wearing women's things.

Theoretically, I'm only transgender/transsexual as far as my history goes. I'm physically post op and have been for many years and have been legally female for years as well, so in that regard I've been cured of a condition which isn't medical and is no longer psychological either but has medical treatment - but it works for some anyway.

While I expressed difficulty with people not wanting to be any gender, because I'm very happy with my own gender, I don't wish it to sound dismissive of them, because I'm not at the same time I don't feel comfortable being included in the same umbrella term because I feel we're different. My discomfort is with the terminology not the individuals.

Perhaps the time has come for me to move on and leave things trans(whatever) behind and just do what I do in everyday life, be an ordinary late middle-aged female. I shall do some thinking and let people know.

Angharad

transgender, the meaning of a word

Teresa L.'s picture

I also have a problem with some usages of words, and it is JUST as bad IN our community, so how can we expect it to be BETTER outside it.

when i first came to realize who and what i was, i did research, and more research. so whos definition of words DO YOU USE? the medical establishment says i am a transsexual (someone who is proceeding with changing their body physically to the opposite sex to match their inner self, well more or less) which is UNDER the transgender umbrella term covering pretty much ANYONE who is NOT male/female binary (intersex, etc want to be listed separately, etc, but it just makes the confusion even GREATER doing this, as technically a lot of them are "transsexuals" only because the doctor/parent got it wrong a birth when they Picked the sex to be for the child). where someone who is just wearing clothes would be defined as a cross dresser (in the original data i found, they had the term transvestite still, defining it as a cross dresser, who had a sexual element involved, not just dressing) but are not really "female" its just about the clothes. but they have the same issues trans do, go into a male bathroom and get harassed at best, if not hit to beaten, some times with stays in the hospital involved. so should they be covered as a "trans" person for the restroom issue? for some its yes, for others its no. what is the difference between a pervert dressed like a woman and a cross dresser? their intent while in the restroom, cross dressers are there just to pee, wash hands and touch up things if needed, a pervert is there for nefarious reasons, so the cis community is afraid, and how are they to tell the difference, and i can understand their reason, even if i dont agree with it

so this being said NOT all transgender persons are medically transitioning, or transitioning at all. THIS is part of what people fear. anyone on HRT, properly, should be sexually unable to assault someone, but a cross dresser or a non op, non hrt gender variant COULD (dont go off on me, i am just showing you what I HAVE been getting back from the public as i have been fighting this all over the internet), and how is the average person to know who is who? do we wear dog tags, or a pink letter T, or the trans symbol like the nazi's did to jews? i am on HRT, pre op, but i am legally female, using the fed government rules. only document not updated yet my birth certificate, which is from CA, and its more bureaucratic bs than denying the change. having to fill it out on THEIR paper to be legal is just asinine, but i digress.

so how does using a SINGLE Term, that is meant to be an umbrella term, as a singular term for transsexuals helping EITHER. i totally understand, like hermaphrodite and transvestite and tranny, some words and terms have negative connotations to them, but it has to stop somewhere. people hear transsexual and think it is about the sex ACT not the physical sex of our bodies, i get it believe me. but it has to stop somewhere, changing the terms at a whim, using them for whatever feels right FOR YOU. we need a cogent list of types, it needs to be universal as POSSIBLE, between our community, the government AND the medical community

no one should be belittled, on ANY side of a debate (arguments are nasty, silly things, real discussion, or debate, is what is needed here) should be avoided, even if "they started it" (does THAT sound familiar to any parents, aunts or uncles? yep the cry of a child trying to defend their rudeness to others. dont get me wrong, i have fallen into that mindset as well, especially when the trolls try to make it personal when the facts and science i present cant be debunked)

so, how to fix this? with the large number of INDEPENDENT groups with their own agenda's, and NOT willing to band together in support for fear of losing control, it wont be. it needs groups at the local level banding together, then them banding together with groups in the state/province, and then talk at the national level. no not everyone will be happy, but ONCE we HAVE accomplished this, we have some authority to say "hey, THIS is how we want to be address/classified/listed as, NOT what YOU came up with." then MORE work will ensue as government AND the medical establishment will try to defend their positions, or they will look weak, compromises might be made, etc. but THEN, and ONLY THEN will we have a comprehensive, and COHESIVE use of terms.

as i am a transsexual (Katie and I had talked about this term a LOT and came up with multiple different ideas, transgender SHOULD be the proper one, but as it has been used for other purposes, its a moot point. finding a name that is descriptive, easy to remember/spell/read AND that people can get behind will be a hard task, but worthwhile i believe, and so did she) i get the feeling that people think we are just about sex, with all the sex industry, and some of our sisters doing work there (which i do NOT denigrate, but it just not my thing) it DOES give the impression that WE ARE just about sex, and some of that is being FORCED sex (makes you wonder who on the christian right is watching this to KNOW about it but hey, whatever, lol) and that makes people AFRAID, as it is tantamount to rape (yes its like tv, its scripted, but how many people think that "reality tv" is really not scripted in any way?) so those with the axe to grind, for whatever reason, use these things to put us in a bad light, so we have terms that many associate with porn, prostitution, etc, but never mention the vast majority of us who are just who we are, parents, aunts/uncles, workers at many types of jobs, etc.

sorry for the long post, but it seems that some are getting upset over things that should NOT be an issue, its a matter of understanding terminology,and USING the same terminology, not what YOUR group uses it for, vs what the OTHER group uses. if we cant straighten out (pun definitely INTENDED, come on people laugh a little) our own issues, how can we expect others to understand us enough NOT to be afraid we are NOT what we say we are?

Teresa L.

It may get worse

It will probably get worse with a woman getting assaulted for wanting to use the women's room. It came close to that a week or two ago in Texas when a less feminine looking woman got detained by a young man concerned she wasn't female and his mother was in the restroom. How far will things go? Will it stop when a less feminine women is found severely beaten or worse? I don't know but would hope this would slowly fade away but some of the boneheads won't let go.

actually those cases HELP

Teresa L.'s picture

our cause, as it shows how stupid this hate and fear is, and that it is baseless. if it happens enough times (it has actually happened several times before, NOT where any laws exist even, just someone feeling they had the right to do it, fishbones in detroit i think it was, now a million dollar lawsuit is in play)

while i would wish no harm on anyone, i hope these incidents will show others how stupid these types of pogroms are.

Teresa L.